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Old 08-19-2008, 04:33 PM   #1
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As I Had Thought

Let me start out with the observation that the prices of gasoline and diesel are high. Obviously the price of crude has a big effect.

What I want to zero in on is the fact that diesel fuel costs eighty cents a gallon more than regular unleaded (or premium for that matter) gasoline. The US is pretty much alone in that difference.

This table is in euros.

http://gasoline-germany.com/internat...ml?changeto=EN

From the link:

England
91 Octane Gasoline: ?1.34
Diesel: ?1.22
Spread: Gasoline is 10% more expensive than diesel


France
91 Octane Gasoline: ?1.39
Diesel: ?1.32
Spread: Gasoline is 5% more expensive than diesel


Japan
91 Octane Gasoline: ?0.97
Diesel: ?0.75
Spread: Gasoline is 29% more expensive than diesel


Australia
91 Octane Gasoline: ?0.94
Diesel: ?1.18
Spread: Gasoline is 26% more expensive than diesel


Germany
91 Octane Gasoline: ?1.43
Diesel: ?1.33
Spread: Gasoline is 18% more expensive than diesel

But at my local gas station
91 Octane Gasoline: $3.83
Diesel: $4.45
Spread: Diesel is 16% more expensive than premium gasoline


So let?s put the myth that the spread of diesel over gasoline has anything whatsoever to do with world demand down as being busted. In most countries that tend to prefer diesel cars, diesel is less expensive than gasoline. But in the US the reverse is true.

There is only one plausible reason: Ultra-Low (15 ppm) Sulfur Fuel is required ONLY in the US. It costs more money to remove the sulfur. This relationship was not true at all in 2006, prior to the advent of ULSD requirements. Gasoline and diesel cost roughly the same (gasoline was more expensive in summer, diesel more expensive in winter) prior to ULSD.

Diesel in the US is more expensive than gasoline and you can exclusively thank the EPA.
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Old 08-19-2008, 04:54 PM   #2
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You're correct, Dave. I had a link at one time that was from a study done I think five years ago that stated that going to the ULSD would increase costs by $0.50 to $0.60 per gallon over costs at that time.
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Old 08-19-2008, 06:53 PM   #3
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Sorry Dave. I'm just going to copy and paste my response from Ecomodder.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Dave View Post
So let’s put the myth that the spread of diesel over gasoline has anything whatsoever to do with world demand down as being busted. In most countries that tend to prefer diesel cars, diesel is less expensive than gasoline. But in the US the reverse is true.

There is only one plausible reason: Ultra-Low (15 ppm) Sulfur Fuel is required ONLY in the US. It costs more money to remove the sulfur. This relationship was not true at all in 2006, prior to the advent of ULSD requirements. Gasoline and diesel cost roughly the same (gasoline was more expensive in summer, diesel more expensive in winter) prior to ULSD.

Diesel in the US is more expensive than gasoline and you can exclusively thank the EPA.
I'm sorry, but your list and conclusion couldn't be further from the truth.

Quote:
Average petrol prices have fallen from 119.51 pence per litre in mid-July to 113.15 now, cutting ?13.63 off the typical two-car family’s monthly spend on petrol. The average price of diesel has in the past month fallen from 131.56 pence per litre to 125.58, a saving of six pence a litre.
? August Fuel Price Report Fleet Directory News: THE Fleet Industry links directory

Why is diesel more expensive than petrol?
Why is diesel more expensive than petrol? | This is Money

Diesel is more expensive than gasoline in most of europe. Scroll down for the list.
Czech diesel price ranked fourth-highest in Europe - Prague Daily Monitor - 21.07.2008

The list at the begining of this thread is so incredibly wrong, it actually claims diesels in the the USA is cheaper than gasoline.
Quote:
USA
Regular 91 OCT in € 0,72
Super 95 OCT in € 0,68
Super Premium 98 OCT in € 0,68
Diesel in € 0,69
http://gasoline-germany.com/internat...phtml?land=229

The high price of diesel has nothing to do with ULSD or the EPA and everything to do with supply and demand. Over the last few years the whole world (not just europe) has been switching from gasoline powered cars to diesel powered cars. Refiners on the other hand can't infinitely vary the proportion of diesel to gasoline they can extract from a barrel of oil. They can only go so far one way or another before drastically increasing the cost of refining. But because the US has remained largely a gasoline market, it has been able to survive without building a any new refineries in the last 30 years by importing refined gasoline from markets where diesel is more in favor.

The upfront cost of a diesel engine plus the cost of fuel more than offsets any fuel economy benefits. The huge premiums I was used to seeing on Craigslist for old beat up Mercedes and TDIs have started to disappear as people wake up to the reality that diesel costs an additional 60 cents a gallon. Sure you still have SVO conversions and biodiesel. If you can find it, more power to you.

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Old 09-05-2008, 07:48 AM   #4
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The Euro Diesel is still actually better (cetane numbers) that ULSD in the USA. They have already had better Diesel Fuel for years. The increased demand is a big reason for the rise in Diesel Prices around the world.

Now to say that the higher cost of diesels and the higher cost of diesel fuel negates the advantage of running diesel is not true. The increased efficiency still offsets the higher cost of diesel if comparing similiar vehicles with the only difference being engines.
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Old 09-17-2008, 12:30 PM   #5
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I think you missed one:
Australia
91 Octane Gasoline: ?0.94
Diesel: ?1.18
Spread: Gasoline is 26% more expensive than diesel

Looks like it's more expensive in Australia too.

If those Japan costs are accurate though, damn I'm going to move there. Even now that means their diesel is cheaper than the US's, if the USD improved a bit more I think both fuel costs would be cheaper. I didn't realize they were so much cheaper than Europe and they have sweet mountain passes!
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Old 09-17-2008, 12:39 PM   #6
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As of today, locally, I saw diesel at $3.99 and regular unleaded at $3.99. Which I'm thrilled about. Gasoline futures are higher, so it's not unexpected.
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