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Old 06-09-2008, 09:30 PM   #11
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Also look into the 2000 - 2003 Honda S2000. I had an 02 and top down driving to 9,000 rpm redline like an arse would still average 28 mpg to a tank.

I'm sure you could average 33 - 35mpg in one and with 240 hp on standby if you want to have some fun, and all in a 2.0 liter 4 cyl.

You could pick up an '03 or older (best ones IMHO) with under 30k miles for under $18K

Only drawback is premium gas is a must.
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Old 06-09-2008, 10:40 PM   #12
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Also look into the 2000 - 2003 Honda S2000. I had an 02 and top down driving to 9,000 rpm redline like an arse would still average 28 mpg to a tank.

I'm sure you could average 33 - 35mpg in one and with 240 hp on standby if you want to have some fun, and all in a 2.0 liter 4 cyl.

You could pick up an '03 or older (best ones IMHO) with under 30k miles for under $18K

Only drawback is premium gas is a must.
I couldn't imagine driving an S2000 and not winding the bejezus out of that beautiful motor! I do remember from the test driving wanting more low-end for around town, though.
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Old 06-09-2008, 10:57 PM   #13
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You have to think of it as a car with 2 personalities.

One is an under powered gas sipper when you keep it below 3,500 rpms and the other rears it's ugly head at around 5,500 rpms and threatens to break both your legs if you let off the gas.

It revs quick so you can get in powerband fast if you need to and it's not a drag car, it's one for the twisties so you can have a lot of fun without completly thrashing it.

2004 and later has more low end due to changing to a 2.2 liter engine and lowering redline like 700 rpm.

I have driven both and still prefer the earlier AP1 models better, though '02 and '03 are best due to getting a glass rear window unlike the '00 and '01.
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Old 06-10-2008, 05:32 PM   #14
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Given the cost of gas, which so called experts say will hit $5/gal by year's end, why would anyone think of a muscle car, Wrangler Guzzer, or pick up truck? And then, to add to the strangeness of this thread, they ask about hypermiling such a vehicle....wow! Lol x 1,000

This post is akin to a smoker posting on a health forum about finding ways to smoke "safely"....different strokes, different folks I guess lol
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Old 06-10-2008, 05:41 PM   #15
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Wow, why the hate?

Should people who have, need, or prefer big vehicles not try to drive for FE?

If I had to drive something I hated and was not comfortable in, I would NOT be able to concentrate on hypermiling.
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Old 06-10-2008, 06:08 PM   #16
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Wow, why the hate?

Should people who have, need, or prefer big vehicles not try to drive for FE?

If I had to drive something I hated and was not comfortable in, I would NOT be able to concentrate on hypermiling.
There is no hate. Where is the hate you speak of? It's one thing to already have a guzzler as the $4 hits, but another thing to think about getting one after $4 gas. It seems to me that unless one is rich, well off, or drives 5 miles a day to work, guzzlers are for the rich and famous...exaggeration for effect ;-) Sure if one has 3, 4 or more kids, then yea, they need a large vehicle regardless of gas costs, but unless that is true, then I find it interesting when one wants such a big motor and/or vehicle. If I were you, I'd find ways to encourage the OP to scale down in vehicle type, size, and motor size, in order to save $ on gas.

So there, I just gave lots of "love" in my post...same thing I gave my own children, and they often appreciate it too. lol

As to driving something one "hates", well, a mature adult has to often do things he "hates" for ther betterment of his financial future, and I dare say the quality of the air. Do you think I drive a Yaris because I love it? Well, I don't hate it, but I'd rather drive a V8 Mustang GT, but being a mature adult, I happily drive a bottom of the line gas sipper, and the money saved on fuel goes into my retirement fund, and that makes me happy.

To look to driving a car as sport and recreation these days is not to be realistic...let the Brad Pitts, the George Cloonies drive the gas hogs, but as to us average folks, well, gas is approaching $5, and I think most of us cannot afford that type of luxury.
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Old 06-10-2008, 08:03 PM   #17
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There is no hate. Where is the hate you speak of? It's one thing to already have a guzzler as the $4 hits, but another thing to think about getting one after $4 gas. It seems to me that unless one is rich, well off, or drives 5 miles a day to work, guzzlers are for the rich and famous...exaggeration for effect ;-) Sure if one has 3, 4 or more kids, then yea, they need a large vehicle regardless of gas costs, but unless that is true, then I find it interesting when one wants such a big motor and/or vehicle. If I were you, I'd find ways to encourage the OP to scale down in vehicle type, size, and motor size, in order to save $ on gas.

So there, I just gave lots of "love" in my post...same thing I gave my own children, and they often appreciate it too. lol

As to driving something one "hates", well, a mature adult has to often do things he "hates" for ther betterment of his financial future, and I dare say the quality of the air. Do you think I drive a Yaris because I love it? Well, I don't hate it, but I'd rather drive a V8 Mustang GT, but being a mature adult, I happily drive a bottom of the line gas sipper, and the money saved on fuel goes into my retirement fund, and that makes me happy.

To look to driving a car as sport and recreation these days is not to be realistic...let the Brad Pitts, the George Cloonies drive the gas hogs, but as to us average folks, well, gas is approaching $5, and I think most of us cannot afford that type of luxury.
Ummm... it's not THAT much of a luxury unless you're a traveling salesman or someone who puts 30K+ a year on a car. I used to be one of those. Then I got a job closer to my home. Now I put about 18K a year on it.

Now... if you'd read my original post, you'd see I currently drive a VW Golf. A small, slow, blandmobile that I've managed to hypermile up to about 37.5 mpg, which is about what most people get from their Yarises or new Civics that they paid $14K for to save on fuel. It would be hard to move down from what I've got to get more economy in terms of dollars.

I was asking if one of those "guzzlers" I mentioned, which I find to be fun, attractive vehicles, could average 30mpg+ if I keep using the same sorts of driving techniques I already do to stretch a gallon.

Now, is it really so much of a "luxury" for the rich and glamorous to drive a car that only averages 30mpg?

18K a year=1500 miles per month.
1500 miles at 35 mpg avg is 43 gal of fuel per mo
1500 miles at 30 mpg avg is 50 gal of fuel per mo

At $4 a gal, that's a $28 difference per mo in fuel. $5 gas makes it $35. Yes, it is a bigger difference than it used to be, but it's hardly going to bankrupt me or most people, and both those figures rely on prices that are higher than the local average here (about $3.90 last time I checked). If prices do eventually fall to an extent, which is likely, it becomes even less.

At this point, it's still an affordable choice. Do you ever go out to eat? Spend a little more money on nice clothes? Go to the movies? Rent DVDs? Have any hobbies at all? The difference in fuel would cost about the same on a monthly basis. It doesn't really become a significant issue for me, personally, until you get to under 30 mpg avg. At that point I don't feel the style, power, room, and driving experience is worth the extra fuel costs, but it's still hardly the realm of the rich and famous.

It's also much more economical for me to buy a car that's a few years old for $7500 and get 5-10 mpg less than what I get instead of paying $14-20K for a new one just for the fuel economy. I still want fuel economy, but it's a shame to spend so much money for something if you don't enjoy driving.
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Old 06-10-2008, 08:32 PM   #18
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Ummm... it's not THAT much of a luxury unless you're a traveling salesman or someone who puts 30K+ a year on a car. I used to be one of those. Then I got a job closer to my home. Now I put about 18K a year on it.

Now... if you'd read my original post, you'd see I currently drive a VW Golf. A small, slow, blandmobile that I've managed to hypermile up to about 37.5 mpg, which is about what most people get from their Yarises or new Civics that they paid $14K for to save on fuel. It would be hard to move down from what I've got to get more economy in terms of dollars.

I was asking if one of those "guzzlers" I mentioned, which I find to be fun, attractive vehicles, could average 30mpg+ if I keep using the same sorts of driving techniques I already do to stretch a gallon.

Now, is it really so much of a "luxury" for the rich and glamorous to drive a car that only averages 30mpg?

18K a year=1500 miles per month.
1500 miles at 35 mpg avg is 43 gal of fuel per mo
1500 miles at 30 mpg avg is 50 gal of fuel per mo

At $4 a gal, that's a $28 difference per mo in fuel. $5 gas makes it $35. Yes, it is a bigger difference than it used to be, but it's hardly going to bankrupt me or most people, and both those figures rely on prices that are higher than the local average here (about $3.90 last time I checked). If prices do eventually fall to an extent, which is likely, it becomes even less.

At this point, it's still an affordable choice. Do you ever go out to eat? Spend a little more money on nice clothes? Go to the movies? Rent DVDs? Have any hobbies at all? The difference in fuel would cost about the same on a monthly basis. It doesn't really become a significant issue for me, personally, until you get to under 30 mpg avg. At that point I don't feel the style, power, room, and driving experience is worth the extra fuel costs, but it's still hardly the realm of the rich and famous.

It's also much more economical for me to buy a car that's a few years old for $7500 and get 5-10 mpg less than what I get instead of paying $14-20K for a new one just for the fuel economy. I still want fuel economy, but it's a shame to spend so much money for something if you don't enjoy driving.
Your calculations are a bit skewed. I get 42 to 45 MPG with my Yaris, and that is without even trying much.

So 1,500 miles a month will cost a Yaris driver like myself around 36 gallons, and a more powerful car acheiving 30 mpg about 50 gallons, a difference of 14 gallons, and at $4.25/gal the money difference is $60/month. And over 12 months, that is $720, and if you keep the car 5 years, that difference is around $3,600. Maybe for you that's not much $, but for me it is no small amount. You can change the MPG of either car up or down, but in my opinion, the differences will still be no small number. To use my figures, over 10 years the difference would be over $7,000.

Now in the next few months, the price of gas might go down, then up, then down, but I would bet in the long run, gas will ONLY go up, and as it goes up, the reasons I gave for going small car only get more and more compelling, to be sure.

I say get the muscle car you want for "fun" and forget abut hypermiling, be happy if that's what you think will make you happy....however to repeat my analogy from an earlier post, either smoke and enjoy it, or don't smoke and be worry free of lung cancer. ;-) But one cannot have both, usually.

It's a lot easier to get results hypermiling a small car then a big powerful one.

But in the end, you can buy any car you want, and that is the way it should be and is. But you did post here your question, and I gave you my take on it, and you don't like it. That's cool, no worries.

There are many many others like yourself, that have yet to make the transition mentally, in regard to the climbing of gas prices, but maybe you will, perhaps when gas hits $5 or $6/gal.

You're the boss of course, so do what you want. This is only my opinion.
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Old 06-10-2008, 08:58 PM   #19
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Jeep Wrangler or Cherokee? Hypermile?
I don't understand why people own Jeeps. My family only owned one because they inherited it. And they got rid of it quickly too.
...because some of us actually use them for their intended purposes and not just for mall-crawling

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Old 06-10-2008, 08:59 PM   #20
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To use my figures, over 10 years the difference would be over $7,000.
Which would make the more powerful car for $7,000 a wash compared to the more efficient car at $14,000.

The total money invested in the transportation over 10 years would be fairly similar.

To RollerCoaster: Consider a smaller but sportier car, I've had muscle cars, sporty cars and economy cars.. Everything from an Opel Kadet to a 440 Road Runner and one of the most fun cars I've had was a Suzuki Swift GT 1.3. The little pocket rocket was an autocrosser's dream, point the front wheels where you wanted to go and punch the throttle and you went there, quickly.

From my point of view it's more fun to have a smaller, somewhat less powerful car that you can thrash pretty hard without getting thrown under the jail than it is a big powerful one that you have to really watch yourself with. It's truly amazing how many points you can get on your license in a hurry with a really powerful vehicle, be it car or motorcycle..
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94 Altima 5 spd.. Stock.. 29 mpg combined with basic hypermiling techniques ..

89 Yamaha FZR400 Crotch rocket, semi naked with only the bikini fairing, no lowers, 60 plus mpg

87 Ranger 2.3 5spd.. Does not currently run..
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