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Old 06-05-2010, 09:47 PM   #21
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2500 is probably not low. It's certainly not low in anything I've ever driven. I can't imagine that technique will work if you can't get under 2000. I tend to shift when I reach 1100-1500, entering my next gear at or near idle. Most vehicles would need more RPM than mine but you can probably do better than 2500.

Also, the WOT method is usually better if you don't go quite to the floor, as that may cause the computer to go rich trying to provide every bit of power possible.

Your drive-by-wire throttle is probably programmed to do something like the WOT method already. Mine is...I've been watching TPS lately and it goes to 86 (the maximum reading in my car) at low RPM with only 1/2 of the pedal. Still, practicing the technique has been very effective for me, so the DBW's programming doesn't completely do the job.
Don't get me wrong, I can shift real low at 1500rpm, but it would take me a city block just to get up to speed only to stop again at the next light. Shifting that low, I'd be in 6th gear before I even hit 30mph!

When I did the WOT method, I wasn't going to the floor, just a little bit further than normal. I know the car (or most anyway) goes into open loop when you mash the pedal to the floor, only wasting fuel at that point. I think my TPS also goes to 86 at low rpm's, but not 100% sure, and not sure at how much pedal it takes to get there.
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Old 06-05-2010, 09:49 PM   #22
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I've gotten nearly 46 mpg avg over the lifetime of my xB, and it's got the same .35 cD as the Cube.
It would be nice if I got that kind of mileage! Maybe one day!
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Old 06-05-2010, 10:32 PM   #23
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Not until you change your mindset completely. I don't accelerate to the light a half block ahead, like you do. I start coasting to the light three blocks ahead, and let you jackrabbits trip it for me.

Here's why I don't drive 75 mph.


Your Cube is down at the lower right of the graph, nearly off the chart. It could be at the upper left. Where you place it depends on how you use your right foot. When you insist you have to go 75 mph, you doom yourself to 25 mpg,
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Old 06-06-2010, 03:42 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by ChopsQube View Post
Don't get me wrong, I can shift real low at 1500rpm, but it would take me a city block just to get up to speed only to stop again at the next light. Shifting that low, I'd be in 6th gear before I even hit 30mph!
I wish I had a 6th gear. I'm in 5th at 25-30mph. I'd like at least another 5 gears. I guess my VW is pretty torquey so maybe my exact shift points would be less practical in another car, but it's not ridiculous to be in 6th at 30.

Quite possibly the biggest way to save when not on the highway is to avoid stopping at red lights. This means timing it using whatever legal speed is necessary to get there when it's green. Learn the patterns of your traffic lights, learn how they react to other traffic, and look far ahead as you drive. 20mph cruising through a light saves gas and gets you there faster than 35mph stopping at the light.

Similarly, it also means not going so fast that I have to brake for turns. Every time you brake, you discard energy that you spent fuel to make. I take most turns with little or no braking, if visibility and safety permit.

It's not just about TPS and GPH...it's about accounting for how you make the energy and then where it goes once you've made it.
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Old 06-06-2010, 06:27 AM   #25
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my wife really likes the cube. I can't justify the cost (as with most new vehicles) maybe when they are a few years old.
I don't know what your money situation is, nor do I want to, but you can get into a new 2010 Cube for just a little over $13k which is pretty darn cheap for what you get. My brother bought an equally equipped 2010 Kia Soul for almost the same exact price and payments just four days after I got the Cube. Just an FYI.
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Old 06-06-2010, 06:31 AM   #26
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Not until you change your mindset completely. I don't accelerate to the light a half block ahead, like you do. I start coasting to the light three blocks ahead, and let you jackrabbits trip it for me.

Your Cube is down at the lower right of the graph, nearly off the chart. It could be at the upper left. Where you place it depends on how you use your right foot. When you insist you have to go 75 mph, you doom yourself to 25 mpg,
I understand, and I'm not arguing. It's just going to take me a little while to get used to the concept and keep my foot out of it.

Also, in your city driving, how exactly are you driving? Do you do the WOT method or something else?
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Old 06-06-2010, 06:41 AM   #27
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Quite possibly the biggest way to save when not on the highway is to avoid stopping at red lights. This means timing it using whatever legal speed is necessary to get there when it's green. Learn the patterns of your traffic lights, learn how they react to other traffic, and look far ahead as you drive. 20mph cruising through a light saves gas and gets you there faster than 35mph stopping at the light.

Similarly, it also means not going so fast that I have to brake for turns. Every time you brake, you discard energy that you spent fuel to make. I take most turns with little or no braking, if visibility and safety permit.

It's not just about TPS and GPH...it's about accounting for how you make the energy and then where it goes once you've made it.
Now this is going to be really hard to do in the town where my work is. Right out of the parking lot is a light where the main drag is. It is almost always red, and stays red for at least two minutes. After I finally get through that light, there's another one less than a block away where I have to make a left. That one is 50/50 being red or green, but even when it is green, I'm stuck in the turning lane waiting for a break in the traffic, if any. And traffic in this town is freakin' crazy all the time. It's ridicules.

The rest of the drive past that part is pretty calm and easy except for the fact that there's two different school zones that I have to go through, which means some constant but extremely slow traffic to move through. They're side roads, but are the only ones I can take. Trust me when I tell you that I've tried looking at alternate routes. I lived in this town for nearly my entire life and there isn't any other viable way to go.
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Old 06-06-2010, 11:40 AM   #28
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Also, in your city driving, how exactly are you driving? Do you do the WOT method or something else?
Moderate P&G. I accelerate at ~83 LOD to the PSL, and glide to 5 or 10 mph below it. A delta of 25-40 mph is even better, when road conditions allow it. I can stretch my FE to 55-60 mpg under ideal conditions.
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Old 06-06-2010, 02:26 PM   #29
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Moderate P&G. I accelerate at ~83 LOD to the PSL, and glide to 5 or 10 mph below it. A delta of 25-40 mph is even better, when road conditions allow it. I can stretch my FE to 55-60 mpg under ideal conditions.
I understand the concept of driving that way, but don't waste fuel getting back up to speed again? Also, aren't you concerned about pissing people off that are stuck behind you?

Obviously, I'm not referring to them beating you up (because you're in a moving vehicle), but there's a lot of clowns out there than need the littlest reason for road rage. I don't want some jerk to go blowing by me blasting rocks and grit up in my windshield nor do I want them cutting me off, nearly clipping my bumper. You know how people are these days.
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Old 06-06-2010, 02:39 PM   #30
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Maintaining a steady speed is not the most efficient way to get around. Pulse & Glide (aka P&G) works on some of the same concepts as the WOT technique you've been asking about.

It makes power as efficiently as possible (WOT technique); this means making more than you need to maintain speed. You get acceleration.

Next is neutral coasting to avoid going too fast. While you do this your engine is only turning at idle RPM. That's less energy wasted on extra revolutions with all their friction and reciprocation loss.

Then you put it in gear and accelerate, and the cycle starts all over again.

I drive on lots of shallow rolling hills and I like to combine my P&G with the hills, resulting in a more steady speed and all the advantages of P&G. I pulse up and glide down. I also do some EOC (Engine-Off Coasting) on the longer descents. That's an advanced technique that's only appropriate for people who are comfortable with it, practiced at engine-on neutral coasting, and not somewhere that it is illegal.
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