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Old 12-29-2017, 01:06 PM   #1
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Does Anyone In The United States Still Care About Fuel Economy?

Does Anyone In The United States Still Care About Fuel Economy?

Americans love trucks: Does that mean fuel economy doesn't matter anymore?

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The 54.5 mpg target is already obsolete because of the shift from passenger cars to crossovers, SUVs and pickup trucks.

The original standard was based on an assumption that passenger cars would account for 67% of total U.S. new vehicle sales, and light trucks (pickups, SUVs, vans and crossovers) would be 33%.

The marketplace has flipped that mix. In 2017 through November, light trucks were 63% of the market and passenger cars were 37% and falling.
This is laughable. All these CAFE standards are meaningless if people are still buying behemoths, albeit more efficient ones this time. American have been getting an average fleet MPG in the low 20s since what? The 80s? Yeah, I know cars are heavier now with increasing safety standards and infotainment systems, but c'mon. My new Civic weighs about 2,888 lbs with a 12.4 gal fuel tank. Still pretty light if you ask me. And more spacious than my older BMW e90 3 series that guzzled gas. There's many good choices out there, but people don't want to bother. Not until gas prices go up or we start taxing CO2 emissions.
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Old 12-29-2017, 04:21 PM   #2
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https://norfolk.craigslist.org/cto/d...437353195.html

For the life of me I can't see anything to like in this truck.

$3500 in extra crap and you can't even come close to hauling a 4x8 sheet of plywood in the bed.
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Old 12-29-2017, 05:01 PM   #3
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"The road to hell is paved with good intentions." CAFE set out to make cars more efficient, but they made a mistake by classifying trucks differently, so they fall into another group of vehicles that are not as strict. Back when CAFE set out the regulations, 60% of vehicles were normal cars and 40% were trucks; now it's the other way around with trucks increasing in percentage every year. I couldn't believe when the EPA classified the Chrysler PT Cruiser as a truck.

When I moved to Canada I didn't understand the appeal of trucks, 20 years later I still don't.

People who try to sell their used Toyota trucks are the worse, they think they are sitting on a gold mine forcing people to buy new Toyota trucks. I guess it's a good thing if you are Toyota. I also hate useless truck beds (most trucks on the market).
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Old 12-30-2017, 12:45 AM   #4
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No-one cares about fuel economy in the US because, you said it yourself, there are no carbon taxes, and fuel taxes are too low, meaning cheap fuel that encourages waste. If your fuel was the same price as ours, you'd be spending $5000 a year or $100 a week in a 20 mpg truck.
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Old 12-30-2017, 05:11 AM   #5
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In the UK every year you would be hit with a huge bill for Vehicle Excise Duty. 800 the first year and 220 each year after for the Ford Ranger 2.2L. You don't get anything bigger in the UK. A top of the range Range Rover will set you back 2000 in its first year and 535 each year thereafter for VED.
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Old 12-30-2017, 07:01 AM   #6
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The US govt, playing world cop and poverty perpetrator has already spent close to $70k per citizen buying votes for my whole life. They can KMA as far as paying more taxes. No one here can even name all the taxes they pay.

Apparently the UK follows the principle of taxing car owners into oblivion. If I lived there I would do the same thing I do here, study the tax laws and find the best way to screw the govt out of any taxes they might try to collect.

My best year was making $212k and paying $4k in federal taxes, everything perfectly legal.
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Old 12-30-2017, 09:34 AM   #7
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Trucks have good resale value + lots of ground clearance / interior room + towing ability etc - many reasons to like trucks - I don't have a truck nor do I plan on getting 1 but can see the appeal.
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Old 12-30-2017, 07:22 PM   #8
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I own a ruck, 1998 Nissan Frontier that I get 29 lifetime mpg (best tank 32.4)when not moving firewood, furniture, supplies for fire department events, and anything else I may need a 6 foot bed. It isn’t one of those 3 ton full size trucks like f150 etc as those are really the new rear wheel drive muscle car with luxury trim since most cars aren’t made that way anymore.

Too many Americans like power to the road too much.
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Old 12-30-2017, 10:04 PM   #9
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Canadian here. When I was shopping for a new vehicle in late 2014/early 2015, pump prices were near a multi-year low. Still, I did my research -- including finding out what real drivers were getting on Fuelly -- before deciding on a new vehicle. A significant part of my decision was based on fuel economy, and fuel cost per mile (includes fuel cost per gallon, and MPG combined).

Where I live, diesel typically costs less than regular gas, plus my optional diesel engine gets better fuel economy than the comparable hybrid option. My meticulous records reveal I've saved between CAD$$2,016.37 to $2,334.02 (36.7% to 40.2%) in fuel costs across 2.5 years of driving, and 57,100 km (~35,402 miles).

It's not like I need to save pennies, but a thousand bucks a year more in my pocket while still getting a vehicle I love is a no-brainer.

I realize I'm an odd duck in my ways, though. Few people can relate to hypermiling, breaking old fuel economy records, etc.
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Old 12-31-2017, 04:16 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveMak View Post
Canadian here. When I was shopping for a new vehicle in late 2014/early 2015, pump prices were near a multi-year low. Still, I did my research -- including finding out what real drivers were getting on Fuelly -- before deciding on a new vehicle. A significant part of my decision was based on fuel economy, and fuel cost per mile (includes fuel cost per gallon, and MPG combined).

Where I live, diesel typically costs less than regular gas, plus my optional diesel engine gets better fuel economy than the comparable hybrid option. My meticulous records reveal I've saved between CAD$$2,016.37 to $2,334.02 (36.7% to 40.2%) in fuel costs across 2.5 years of driving, and 57,100 km (~35,402 miles).

It's not like I need to save pennies, but a thousand bucks a year more in my pocket while still getting a vehicle I love is a no-brainer.

I realize I'm an odd duck in my ways, though. Few people can relate to hypermiling, breaking old fuel economy records, etc.
With the higher fuel prices paid by drivers in other arts of the world, I can understand the most important thing, frugality beats false opulence every time. That does not mean I can even get my own family on board the frugality train.
Being in the position of having the ability to buy cars with what I have saved by driving frugally, for decades, is hard to understand. Several of my family members are always interested in cars like the ECHO, but they end up buying the SUV type vehicles. At least my wife drives her Rogue to an average of 32 mpg. Calling the Rogue a SUV, CUV, or whatever is a joke. It's a station wagon. but call it that and no one in the USA would buy one. Call my Mirage a 5 door hatchback. Give me a break, it's a station wagon. The coupe version of the Echo was only built for the US market. The Mirage, totally trashed buy the auto rag writers, is considered a luxury car in less opulent markets.

Compared to the Mirage the Echo is a rocket ship. With the Imola (BMW Mini) rims and Ecopias, it's a rocket ship that handles like it is on rails and I don't wreck cars trying to go beyond their limits, at least not in the last 3 decades.

The 1971 Opel station wagon that did 128 mpg in 1972 was my wake up moment. I HAD to know how in the heck they could basically increase fuel economy by over 300%, so I learned. It has not changed and I did something about it by inventing a power train alternative that changed the playing field, but as in the mythical story of Cassandra, no one believes it can be that good.

Predictions of dramatic changes in the basic design of vehicles seem to ignore the catastrophic effect any radical change would have on the economics of transportation. It's like a miracle surgery that ignores the fact that your recovery period is longer than your life expectancy.
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