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Old 06-08-2006, 07:39 AM   #11
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Man...I knew I need to be more aggressive with my FASing...you guys start right away! Still, some of the distances you mention are amazing. I'm lucky to get in a 1 km glide (.61 miles) before an incline or before I've got traffic on my tail.

I'm serious, I don't think there's a level section of road in the city. Everything is .5% inclines and declines. If rolling resistance (and red lights) wasn't an issue I could probably roller-coaster it all the way to work (just have to power up one hill).
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Old 06-08-2006, 08:26 AM   #12
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Looks like the "FAS" term is going to stick ... I was generally avoiding it, since it's not really FAS on a non-hybrid. (I don't have Auto Stop to begin with, so I can't force one ) - Ah well, FAS it is.

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I'm serious, I don't think there's a level section of road in the city. Everything is .5% inclines and declines.
Hills are to your advantage if you pick a good route - you can get better FE by FASing in hilly terrain than you can on flatland. Ask Dan about that.

Aim for the steeper uphills with more gradual descents, rather than the other way around if you can. Search for Dan's Prius hilly route comparison.
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Old 06-08-2006, 10:07 AM   #13
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this is how i get to school and this nets me a 50 + mpg segment cold start of course assuming temps are around 50 F + here is how i get to school and this could score a 55 mpg segment if i score 80% through the lights.



- ROll out of my driveway, looking left and right

- roll into position facing the direction I want to go to

- Key on!

- REvs rise, immediatley clutch into 1st.

- The lightest accleration you have ever done towards 2000 rpms

- shift and then baby accel again till...

- ...the hill dips down a bit and then immediately shift into 4th and revs will be still high (kinda strange really, but i guess the ECU doesn't allow revs to drop below a certain number on a very cold start) 100 feet later i have a big bump followed by a right turn.

- 1/4 pulse up to 50 km/h (30mph) albiet slowly and then first engine kill and coast up to first stop sign.

- turn right bump start into 3rd, rev rise and then shove it into 2nd gear, no rev matching!

- accelerations get a bit more agressive now, rowing through 3rd, and 4th over some mild inclines and then a FAS towards the 4 way stop sign.

- slow down towards the 4 way, bump start into 3rd, while still slowing down (i can bump start while i'm slamming the brakes in case an emergency manuver) by the time the rev rise and settles i shove it into 2nd and then roll away from the 4 way :P when there are is a car in the OPPOSING direction (not in front but left and right) then I will stop and then shove into 1st gear. Stop signs are a plauge of life but these are my local stops so I just know when to roll and when to stop... judge it from there....

- up a incline and greeted by another stop sign already! instead of hardcore fasing for 5 seconds and then bumping again i just slowly accel towards 2000 rpms in 2nd gear and then N coasting it towards the stop sign. The hill should stop me without me using any brakes.

- Look left, coast is clear, take a left and then up towards a small incline and then over the bridge of beautiful highway 1 where my road begins to merge with the highway boys! so from 1 lane it turns into 3. Now get this I have to get on the very right lane with tons of highway boys just exited in! As soon as I get over the mild incline and the road drips very low I FAS and then try my best to get on the very right lane. Where I dip for around 200 feet or so then.

- A sharp right I must make, followed by a merge bump start before the turn, and rev match into 3rd to enforce engine braking. Normally a driver would take this turn at 2nd gear but I follow a racing line hoping to minimize any tire screetching and making the turn with 3rd. Look left quick to see no cars will t bone me (one accord ran a red while I was FAS and I had to slam the brakes/bumped and waited for him to past at a very high speed)

- up the moderate hill while i drive with load in 3rd gear at 1700 rpms the hill will start to dip down and left when i reach the top. This is where I look on the opposite side of the road, if i see cars then proceed through the hill and down where I will see a light (meaning it was green for awhile) but if I don't see any cars (ghost town on the opposite side) then that means the apex corner will be greeted by a red light. So I FAS at the top of the hill and proceed slowly around the bend with all these lights going to greet me.

- Past one light, 10 feet later past enough one, when the hill starts levling out i have to bump to get my pulse on towards the 3rd light i will turn left.

- A somewhat flat 1/4 mile towards another light which I try to predict the light. If green far away FAS (by the time i get there it will red), or if its red now just 5th gear towards it hoping by the time i get there it will turn green.

Play the game like that for 3 more lights.

Then take a right and this part of the road is a long stretch that dips down. I can see why people love to past me and just rip it up this road but in the very end of it followed by a blind apex to the left. There is a light, and using the road as my prediction I can tell if the light around the corner is going to be red (no cars on the opposite side of traffic) or it is going to be green (mobs of cars after another on the opposite direction) . Either or I always FAS towards it because that light is very picky and only turns green for a limited amount of time (since the other road is a highway so it has higher light priority).

If i'm lucky I can fas through it, down some more apexes, maybe make it that light! road dips down and then up (like a roller coaster!) and maybe get lucky and past that light too! more dips and a big main intersection where I have to make a left.

- make that left, as I'm turning left (its a big road) as soon as I get to 2000 rpms 2nd gear cut the engine and roll towards another light, then make a right, past a bump and hopefully just enough momentum into a free parking lot!


55 mpg. over 5 .2 miles

60 mpg if i hit all the lights on the way, but lol that's rare I have to stop on 1 or two evenually. If i can predict that green light will turn green and FAS all way to it then the mpg hit isn't as hard, if I can FAS through it then the mpg hit will be blessed ;D Just it sucks when your FASING and the light turns yellow on you... but no one is looking

when i get to the third stop sign my engine temp needle is starting to climb and engine water coolant temp is at 60 degrees C. I"m not on synthetic by the way, but I did had my oil filled not to the max lines.
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Old 06-08-2006, 10:31 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MetroMPG
Looks like the "FAS" term is going to stick ... I was generally avoiding it, since it's not really FAS on a non-hybrid. (I don't have Auto Stop to begin with, so I can't force one ) - Ah well, FAS it is.
How about FESing (Forced Engine Stop)?

As for hilly terrain, I'm pretty limited with my route choices. I think I just need to be more aggressive with the engine-off overall. Yeah, I know, and I need a MID.
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Old 06-08-2006, 10:42 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 95metro
I think I just need to be more aggressive with the engine-off overall. .
at load or off!
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Old 06-08-2006, 10:54 AM   #16
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Red line is on my way to school (as described above)

The blue dots are the FAS points

The blue line is on my way home, notice the change in direction?

The green dots are the FAS points on my way home
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Old 06-08-2006, 10:58 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 95metro
Yeah, I know, and I need a MID.
Now you're talking! Arguably more important than an exhaust system.

FES... I don't know, isn't it kind of uncouth to talk about FESes in public?

Sort of like the short-lived name of the Canadian Conservative Reform Alliance Party...
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Old 06-08-2006, 11:05 AM   #18
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Neat map, Phil.

It underscores yet another similarity between regular "high performance" (i.e. fast) driving and high performance efficiency driving: lap times get better as you learn a race track's optimal line and braking points.

MPG gets better as you figure out the ideal FAS points, light timing and other factors on regularly travelled public roads.
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Old 06-08-2006, 11:07 AM   #19
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ROFL - FESes...and I forgot about the CCRAP party (I don't like politics anyway)...lol...

Okay, how about COD (Coasting On Demand)?

As for the MID > Exhaust argument...Yeah, I'll debate on that one for a while. I suppose I just have to PM Yoshi if I decide on the MID?
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Old 06-08-2006, 12:19 PM   #20
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I have another suggestion for the abbreviation. How about Engine Off Coasting?
When I take my wife to work I have already done more EOC( ) than engine on in a 5.8 mile trip. I roll down my driveway(engine off) bump start and accelerate for 1/4 mile then kill the engine and coast for 1/2 mile up to the stop sign. I then bump start and accelerate for another 1/4 mile then kill the engine and coast for 3/4 mile to the next stop sign. I then bump start and accelerate to 50mph in about .4 miles and kill the engine and coast for .6 miles to the next stop sign. I then bump start and turn onto a state highway. If I'm lucky and there is no traffic, I can run 45 mph until the speed limit drops to 45 a mile later. After 1 more mile,(2 altogether) I can, if the traffic and lights work out right, kill the engine and coast for 1.1 miles all the way to the door of my wife's work. I have recently been able to acheive a 61+mpg segment by doing this. Before the head mods I was lucky to see 54-56.
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