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Old 04-10-2007, 06:29 PM   #11
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Wow! Is there a full moon out or what. It's been an interesting 2 days here at GS.

I guess I'll throw more gasoline on the fire since the team challenge was my brain child.

First I want to apologize to rh77. Rick I didn't know that I was going to handing you such a hot potato when I ask you to be the Commish. Sorry for dumping steaming coals on you head but I think you're doing a good job under trying conditions.

CO ZX This is not competitive auto racing. There are no sponsors, prize money, not even a blurb in the USA today. You're the only one that has turned this into something it not. We are not anywhere near a finished product and have been consistant from the start that this is a work in progress. If you can't deal with it during the growing pains then move on to something else.

This was two guys, Metro and I , idea that was put together for the following reasons:
It was to be Fun
Help us stay sharp and save gas
Help bring attention to GS and maybe increase membership.

The grand scheme was to start the challenge work the bugs out and open it up to the rest of the site. Well we had a team want to join before the bugs were worked out and against my better judgment I said yes. I take full responsibility for that. Through all the correspondence, PMs and threads it was always stated that this was a work in progress and that we would be changing things as we go. Playing it by ear as the saying goes. As a matter of fact we dropped the Highly Modified car requirement so that the team that wanted in would have a legal team. We wanted this to be inclusive not exclusive. Now here we are and it seem we have lost site of the purpose of this(see above).

CO said it best" A teams a team" The team is SG site not the 15-20 people in the team challenge. We need to look at the big picture not who's going to be on top in 28 days, 42 day, or 6 months. Nobody will care or even remember in 6 months all the hassles we went through trying to get it right.(Expect rh77). It might take that long to get it in a workable fashion and then I'm sure we will still run into problems. Most of the snipping has absolutely no effect on the final out come. Let's look at the forest and not just the trees and do what's best for GS and not my FE team.
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Old 04-10-2007, 07:28 PM   #12
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Don't worry, it's all part of the job

It's not a problem to act in the sense of mediation. I don't know what else to do to prove my sincerity for ensuring a just competition. If it helps, my career is based upon Health, Science, and the rules of the Federal Government. I'll leave it at that.

I understand that the competition could be likened to the "Superbowl" of Auto Efficiency. For decades, the NFL Superbowl has been played. Even before this competition started, years of rules were hammered out.

The FE Challenge is the first of its kind. Instead of trying to think of everything and have a 40-page rulebook, it remained simple and adaptations were made along the way to make it feasible. If this continues next year, I'm sure a solid set of rules will be established. As I said before, it's hard to think of everything in the beginning. In Rally Racing, rules are changed every year -- sometimes in the middle of a competition -- as the stage captain sees fit based on guidelines. At the end of a race, if a car has been found out of compliance it is removed from the podium, or if a car crashed and cancelled a stage, concessions are given to those who couldn't race. I can state more examples.

Point being -- Along with all participants, I want this to be fair. I don't have a stake in who wins, loses, or draws. I get feedback and concerns from participants and make decisions based on the rules, the flexibility of the rules and participants, and votes tallied.

I'm not going to bail out on this myself if I should disagree with the decisions of the majority, for example. It comes down to being reasonable, keeping an open mind, and accepting the vote of the majority. That goes for all...

-Rick aka other stuff
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Old 04-10-2007, 09:08 PM   #13
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I guess I should throw in my 2 cents.
"It was intended as a fun way to involve people who recognize that a little friendly competition can be a good motivator."
This quote bears repeating so that we don't loose sight of the spirit of the FE Team Challenge.

The way I see it, the rules are becoming solidified. I don't see them changing much for the next cycle. Perhaps we shouldn't start the next cycle until the new set of rules are laid out. rh77, you'll need to take the lead and establish a fair set of rules. And like COZX2 said, not everyone will be happy with all of the rules, but that's too bad. If someone wants to have fun and reap the benefits of being in the Team Challenge they'll need to follow the rules (which have been laid out for good reason, right?)


I would like to see the cycle kept at 28 days. I know many members have voted to extend it to 42, and I applaud their willingness to strive for good FE for an extended time, but I feel that a longer cycle dillutes the motivation. 42 days is a long time. A longer cycle might let attention wane, "It'll all average out, I'll drive better next time". A shorter 28 day cycle should help keep the team members focused on a daily basis. Plus it will allow for quicker turnover of new members and give current members some respite. It's like being on a rollercoaster ride that's too short, it makes you want to get back on again.

In my case, knowing there was a time limit within reach helped me stay focused. Before the Team Challenge I had a tough time staying focused for one whole tank. Because of the Team Challenge I was able to get 4 personal best tanks in a row.

It's time for me to step back and digest what I did so I can learn from it, carry those benefits with me, and integrate them into my daily habits. If the cycle was 42 days I'd be stuck in a dillema; I'd want to get good FE, but I'd also want to get home on time so I could eat,drink, rest. The end result would be that I'd get neither. I'd drive fast sometimes, slow other times, and not really learn anything from it. If you're following me, I'm also saying that I'm stepping down from team Slow Burn. Notify other eager applicants that there is an opening that needs to be filled. ( do we need to vote on a new set of rules on how to draft members into existing teams?)
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Old 04-10-2007, 09:43 PM   #14
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Unhappy Crap -- I'm honestly heartbroken

Quote:
Originally Posted by DRW View Post
If you're following me, I'm also saying that I'm stepping down from team Slow Burn. Notify other eager applicants that there is an opening that needs to be filled. ( do we need to vote on a new set of rules on how to draft members into existing teams?)
DRW -- I've seen the data first-hand and you've excelled tremendously. It would really be a bummer to see you step down. Even if you didn't try too hard, your participation would excel.

If it's any consolation, I know exactly how some of you are feeling. There's a responsibility to a team, yet, there are deadlines, and getting to your destination in the flow of traffic. I struggle with this on a daily basis myself -- mostly trying to stay out of other people's way while I try to keep the SG in the sweet spot.

On the way home tonight, I was following a semi-truck because the rain was heavy and the trailer cleared the roadway and provided draft. The driver became agitated, slowed to 45 in 70 and put his hazard flashers on. After I went around, he sped-up and turned off the blinkers. Without someone in front taking the heat, it's tough. Especially around the 4-5pm hours, I feel like a snail with rabbits about to jump over me. I get it.

If the cycle stayed at 28, would you stay, DRW?

Would a poll be sufficient, or even if 42-days were selected, would people leave?

I was just mentioning to my Father-in-Law tonight that the competition really brought out the best driving in just about everyone, and personal records were broken. When I showed him the spreadsheet, he could hardly believe the numbers. We all know it's possible. He even went to the site on his own for the first time.

I know it's a real struggle -- like running the the 12-hours of Sebring every time you get into your vehicle. It's tough, but rewarding.

I even ran the numbers for myself. What I thought was hard work yielded a meager 4.6% contribution for this month -- and I even fixed a busted torque converter problem.

Let me come right out and ask -- what does everyone want from this? What are your expectations, feelings, disappointments, struggles. Should I post a poll on the 42-day average? Does it even matter any more
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Old 04-10-2007, 11:42 PM   #15
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"If the cycle stayed at 28, would you stay, DRW? "

If the cycle stayed at 28 days, I'd still be done with the first cycle.
What's the point of a cycle if we keep going? Maybe it's because I've been involved in competitive athletics since I was 12, but when I reach the finish line I tend to stop racing.

Yes, I did look at this as if it were a race of sorts. I made some sacrifices, kept my focus on the goal, sought to strenghten my advantages, and made FE a much bigger priority in my life. I feel that it's paid off, too. I know more about getting good FE in my specific car and while driving on my regular routes. These are lessons that each member needs to learn on their own. We've all read about the tricks to getting good FE, many of us have written excellent posts on how to get better FE. Now it's time to get out there and do it! Who's next?

If I thought the Team Challenge was a continuous event, then how would that differ from regular day to day living? I looked at it like a relay race; I went first, who's next? I may take another turn again, but lets give someone else a shot, someone who isn't already on a team. This is an easy way to get an individual onto an existing (and successful ) team.

By keeping the cycle down to 28 days you're keeping the commitment lighthearted. It's a one night stand vs marriage. Easy come, easy go. We can still be friends. I'll still say 'hello' when we bump into each other. It's not you, it's me. LOL

Relax, it's not like I'm going to forget how to draft or P+G.
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Old 04-11-2007, 06:00 AM   #16
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I'm lost. Did the rules on the Super Bowl really change?
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Old 04-11-2007, 08:30 AM   #17
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Has NostraDRWmas been reading my mind?
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