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Old 04-29-2009, 03:56 PM   #1
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I'm here to piss on everyone's cheerios... (MPG)

As an FYI, all cars even today are conducted and measured with the CAFE EPA rating which was instituted in the 70s, however in order to provide more useful information to the consumer, they adjust it to account for things like more aggressive driving etc, they have done this three times as the original and 1985 ratings weren't quite representative of people's actual driving habits. The CAFE rating is what is used to determine whether or not an automaker will get penalties, which is why you hear the CAFE rating for cars at 27mpg yet you see few cars in dealership lots providing averages of 27mpg.
I choose the Civic VX because it's a "dream car" for a lot of folks and the ones that are on here get far far lower MPG ratings, lower than even the 1985 MPG ratings, which in my opinion is because people don't drive these cars as conservatively and they're not as tuned up as they should be.

Miles Per Gallon Ratings will be as follows; City, Highway, Combined.
1994 Civic VX Federal
2007 Estimated EPA rating: 39, 50, 43
1985 EPA Rating: 47, 56, 51
CAFE Rating: 52, 72, 60

1994 Civic VX California
2007 Estimated EPA rating: 37, 45, 40
1985 EPA Rating: 44, 51, 47
CAFE Rating: 49, 65, 55

2000 Insight
2007 Estimated EPA rating: 49, 61, 53
1985 EPA Rating: 61, 70, 65
CAFE Rating: 68.1881, 89.2029, 76.2742



I only found out where I could obtain this data by contacting the EPA directly and was promptly directed to the following link:
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/download.shtml
Ratings are available for all tested cars going back to 1978.

The format in which you download it in will vary but if and when you do download it, for the CAFE EPA MPG ratings, look under "UNRND COMP
(EPA)" which stands for Unrounded Composite (fuel economy).
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Old 04-29-2009, 04:21 PM   #2
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I've found that data before. I thought everyone was aware of those adjustments.

The actual test procedure has changed for 2007, though. They added a few tests...
http://fueleconomy.gov/feg/fe_test_schedules.shtml
There, look for "New tests" above the tab-interfaced graph.
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Old 04-29-2009, 04:35 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theholycow View Post
I've found that data before. I thought everyone was aware of those adjustments.

The actual test procedure has changed for 2007, though. They added a few tests...
http://fueleconomy.gov/feg/fe_test_schedules.shtml
There, look for "New tests" above the tab-interfaced graph.
Well the actual data that is "new to me" was the CAFE MPG rating which I had been unable to find. I'm glad to know that the Civic VX was actually capable of 72mpg on the highway.
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Old 04-30-2009, 05:07 AM   #4
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Makes ya wonder how miraculous the aero on basjoos' '92 CX/DX at 64mpg is...
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Old 04-30-2009, 06:22 AM   #5
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you bastard, now i have to get another bowl of cherrios and i'm already late for work. thanks a lot *******.
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Old 05-10-2009, 07:04 PM   #6
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I thought that one reason they were adjusted was because of the detrimental effect the mandatory ethanol additive has had on MPG
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Old 05-10-2009, 07:30 PM   #7
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Epa ratings have changed for several very significant reasons. In 1985 the national speed limit was 55 MPH, so the standard highway testing was limited to that speed. Current testing is at significantly higher speeds.

Current ratings also include testing in much more congested city driving conditions.

Methanol contents of 10% also have an effect on mileage, to the tune of several percentage points.

I find the current ratings are fairly close for the average driver. My wife drives conservatively and she can usually come close to the highway EPA rating for her 09 Rogue.

I may be mistaken but I think the CAFE ratings were not indicative of real world driving conditions. Todays agressive drivers probably can't even come close to the current ratings, and in my local routes the drivers that pass me accelerating towards a red light, are perfect examples of the general stupidity in the average driver.

All that being considered, my lifetime average in my Insight has reached 63.5 MPG, over the last 10k miles. The previous owner's average was a pitiful 43 MPG. Considering the current rating of 47 MPG for combined mileage, and the fact that my only mods are a grille block and higher tire pressure, most of my improvement is due to very conservative driving style. I have hit 82.7 MPG in a local 20 mile trip, as well as about 70 MPG average at highway speeds averaging 55 MPH, avoiding the Interstates here where that driving style would be dangerous. My best highway tank so far was 70.2 MPG for 650.5 miles, most of it in one long days driving.

My cheerios are fine.

I would recommend using the boys room.

regards
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Old 05-10-2009, 11:01 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R.I.D.E. View Post
Epa ratings have changed for several very significant reasons. In 1985 the national speed limit was 55 MPH, so the standard highway testing was limited to that speed. Current testing is at significantly higher speeds.

Current ratings also include testing in much more congested city driving conditions.

Methanol contents of 10% also have an effect on mileage, to the tune of several percentage points.

I find the current ratings are fairly close for the average driver. My wife drives conservatively and she can usually come close to the highway EPA rating for her 09 Rogue.

I may be mistaken but I think the CAFE ratings were not indicative of real world driving conditions. Todays agressive drivers probably can't even come close to the current ratings, and in my local routes the drivers that pass me accelerating towards a red light, are perfect examples of the general stupidity in the average driver.

All that being considered, my lifetime average in my Insight has reached 63.5 MPG, over the last 10k miles. The previous owner's average was a pitiful 43 MPG. Considering the current rating of 47 MPG for combined mileage, and the fact that my only mods are a grille block and higher tire pressure, most of my improvement is due to very conservative driving style. I have hit 82.7 MPG in a local 20 mile trip, as well as about 70 MPG average at highway speeds averaging 55 MPH, avoiding the Interstates here where that driving style would be dangerous. My best highway tank so far was 70.2 MPG for 650.5 miles, most of it in one long days driving.

My cheerios are fine.

I would recommend using the boys room.

regards
gary
Well considering that I'm within 3.5% of CAFE MPG rating on the 2004 Volvo S60 I've been driving around only with the tires inflated to sidewall rating, I have to disagree with you on some parts. I probably can agree that the CAFE MPG ratings during the early 90s, thorugh the 80s etc. would be much harder to attain today due to them NOT being tested with fuels that have ethanol in them. However, cars tested within the last 10 years would have been tested with ethanol in them, so the CAFE ratings from within the last 10 years should be far more realistic than the ones from 20 or 30 years ago.. One thing that you guys have probably not done is given your car a serious tuneup or rebuild. I doubt all the cars on this board are running in top condition, they may not be running poorly, but they're not running like they're new, hurting mileage.
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Old 05-11-2009, 04:41 AM   #9
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but then you have to look at the cost of the tuneup or rebuild. if you are mechanically inclined and can do the work yourself then it may not be that big of a deal but if you would have to take it to someone to do the work, it would take quite a while to see a return on that investment.

also how much the car is worth vs doing all that work to it. mine is a salvaged vehicle that is 12 years old and has 185K on the odo. the value of it maybe in the realm of a brand new tube television.

I will admit that I may be able to get better mileage than I am now. I am actually just trying to get what I got last summer (I know it isn't summer yet).

what may also be hurting me is that the body damage to my car wasn't fixed properly. it isn't that noticeable from the top but from the bottom, you can see that it wasn't done right.
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Old 05-11-2009, 06:17 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R.I.D.E. View Post
Methanol contents of 10% also have an effect on mileage, to the tune of several percentage points.
When did methanol come to the party?
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