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Old 01-15-2012, 02:04 AM   #21
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Re: What cheap new cars do we "like"?

I believe the iQ (if it's the same as we have here) is a wider (more drag) and shorter model than Aygo. Aygo is quite roomy for 4 people, more than you might expect and it comes as a 5-door and the iQ doesnt. The automatic is a robotic manual with a single clutch so there is total loss of drive for half a second or so between the gears which means you have to learn how the transmission shifts so you don't need to accelerate in the middle of a shift which can be potentially dangerous. I suspect this would be even worse than the cvt (is it really that bad?) The manual is a bit more straigh forward and easy to drive.

To bad the yaris has the center mounted instrument display because it makes it feel less like a real car and more like riding a tram or something.
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Old 01-15-2012, 03:52 AM   #22
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Re: What cheap new cars do we "like"?

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To bad the yaris has the center mounted instrument display because it makes it feel less like a real car and more like riding a tram or something.
On that one, I can comment and truly know what I'm saying.

the 2012 Yaris has a properly mounted gauge cluster, rather than center mounted.
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Old 01-15-2012, 08:05 AM   #23
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Re: What cheap new cars do we "like"?

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Prius is a no go for her. She has a real problem with its manufacturing process since she's abit of a econut. While it mileage is good i also know it may end up costing alot to maintain down the road. She is also aware of the fact that on a carbon foot print basis its like a nuclear bomb for the enviroment. She keeps stating that just to make a prius it is worse for the enviroment than to build and drive a hummer 2 for several years.
Sounds like she read that hack job report. Here's the brief on what's wrong with it; the report based the lifetime calculations with the Hummer 2 going 300k miles and the Prius only lasting 100k.
The Sudsbury nickel mine is another source of Prius FUD. The environmental damaged there all happened years before the Prius came to be. Mostly to meet our demand for stainless in appliances, flatware, and non-hybrid cars. The amount of nickel that went into batteries for Toyota hybrids is a drop in the bucket compared to the mine's output.

The Prius has available for over a decade, and it has been no more costlier than any other Toyota to maintain. Even when used as a taxi. With the regen braking, shoes and pads last over a 100k miles. The engine is spun up to 1000rpm before firing up, in addition to seeing less total hours. The transmission is as mechanically complicated as a one speed manual.

Toyota babies the battery. It falls under the Federal emission warranty of 8yr/100k miles and the 10yr/150k one for Carb states (Mass. is one)
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Old 01-15-2012, 03:58 PM   #24
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Re: What cheap new cars do we "like"?

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Sounds like she read that hack job report. Here's the brief on what's wrong with it; the report based the lifetime calculations with the Hummer 2 going 300k miles and the Prius only lasting 100k.
The Sudsbury nickel mine is another source of Prius FUD. The environmental damaged there all happened years before the Prius came to be. Mostly to meet our demand for stainless in appliances, flatware, and non-hybrid cars. The amount of nickel that went into batteries for Toyota hybrids is a drop in the bucket compared to the mine's output.

The Prius has available for over a decade, and it has been no more costlier than any other Toyota to maintain. Even when used as a taxi. With the regen braking, shoes and pads last over a 100k miles. The engine is spun up to 1000rpm before firing up, in addition to seeing less total hours. The transmission is as mechanically complicated as a one speed manual.

Toyota babies the battery. It falls under the Federal emission warranty of 8yr/100k miles and the 10yr/150k one for Carb states (Mass. is one)
This^^ And with the tax credits for a Prius, you aren't even that high above your price point. And they are COMFORTABLE and ROOMY, which is VERY important for something she will be spending so much time in. The interior room is a class apart from most of the other cars on your list.

I know this is also pretty far above your pricepoint, but you can get a Golf or Jetta TDI in the 24-26k range. 40s, though you may see up to 50 or possibly more, for fuel economy on the highway, low 30s in town, proven highly reliable cars that cost very little to maintain despite the high cost of many of their parts. Also, since she is an "environut", she should be quite attracted to clean diesel, especially since you can probably find a biodiesel distributor in your area. Best yet, they retain their resale better than any other car near their selling price. Really, if environmentalism is going to be a big factor in the purchase of a new car, you can't escape the fact that small diesels are the best thing we could be putting on the road. Plus, both cars are handsomely equipped with options that improve the driving experience, bluetooth, steering wheel audio controls to name a couple, which are important to think about if a person is going to spend so much time in their car. The bare bones econobox is appealing from a price point of view, but when someone spends that much time in their car, one must start thinking about other things as well. With the cost of car payments and insurance (assuming neither of you have a bad driving record) this type of car shouldn't be a budget killer, especially when compared to your past experiences with the BMW or a Jeep. $1000 miles a week though..... You are already looking at nearly $500 a month for fuel no matter what car you buy.
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Old 01-15-2012, 04:12 PM   #25
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Re: What cheap new cars do we "like"?

Well we went out for a few rides today. Had a fiat for most of it since the dealer insisted we take it for a few hours. We even took it to look at other cars. It really is pretty nice. Its a bit buzzy and noisey but its to be expected. The automatic isnt that great though. Its constantly shifting or hanging up and seems to always be looking for the right gear without ever finding it. Price wise its a little higher than we want to spend but they are fairly desperate to sell them since they not really moving. As a matter of fact they are having alot of canceled orders and even a few trade back after only a few hundred miles. The car i drove today had been bought and canceled 3 times. They had about 90 cars on the lot and they said half they dont expect to sell anytime soon. They also said if we wanted a paritcular combo to order soon because fiat was gonna stop sending cars to dealers for abit so they wouldnt get stuck with excess inventory. Some of the cars on the lot were also incomplete which i found disturbing. Some were missing trim pieces while other didnt have standard options on them like the blue tooth or all the stereo speakers. Dealer said they were the early cars they got and its been improved since then. Reminds of the early pt cruiser days when people were buying them unfinished and chrysler would send the parts later except they arent selling the fiats, they are sitting on them. Still a nice car and reports say gets about 42mpgs. Sloppy handling of the actual car sales though. They actually offer a million mile warranty to if you want to spend the money so they are standing behind it sort of.
Im gonna go look at some more tomorrow like the mazda2 again and im going to try to see a turbo sonic but reports are coming in that the cruise version is melting pistons and burning excess oil so who knows.
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Old 01-15-2012, 07:27 PM   #26
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Re: What cheap new cars do we "like"?

The federal hybrid incentives have expired. There are ones for plug ins.

The state might still have some though. HOV passes are a big one for some areas.

The gen 2 Prius seats were lacking in comfort. They were improved for the gen3. No word yet on the c.

If a hybrid becomes a possibility, I'd check out the Insight2. Most users are reporting better than EPA with it, and making a deal might be possible with the Prius c announced. The CRZ also does better than tested if the driver is willing keep it efficient.

While at the Mazda dealer, look at the new Mazda3 with Skyactiv. It's 1 to mpg worse than the 2 in the city, but 4 to 5 better on the highway. Depending on your wife's drive, the monthly costs might be a wash between the two.
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Old 01-16-2012, 03:08 PM   #27
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Re: What cheap new cars do we "like"?

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We even took it to look at other cars.
LOVE IT!!!
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Old 01-16-2012, 04:53 PM   #28
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Re: What cheap new cars do we "like"?

ya, the fiat guy pretty much insisted on it. It was handy to go test other cars and actually show them that the others are willing to bend over backwards to make the sale.
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Old 01-17-2012, 02:08 PM   #29
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Re: What cheap new cars do we "like"?

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The federal hybrid incentives have expired. There are ones for plug ins.
I forgot that!
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Old 01-17-2012, 06:39 PM   #30
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Re: What cheap new cars do we "like"?

In a surprising turn of events the fiat is out of the running. I went to pay for one in cash today, nothing fancy just a middle of the line up car. As im handing over the cash I look at the price breakdown and notice a charge for $350 dollars. I ask what thats for and they just casually toss out "its the charge for a spare tire". I lost my mind. How can anyone possibly convince themselves that could sell a single not-even full size spare for that much. Thats like 3% of the cars total. They offered to remove it but it was to late at that point. if there gonna gouge me that bad when im trying to pay for it imagine what would happen once they got my money and i needed a part.
In another turn of events the Honda Fit has taken the lead. Looks like people are able to pull 40 plus out of it and my wife kind of likes it. We havent driven it yet but hope to this weekend. The mazda2 is also still a consideration but we will see. I know i can get one for 13.5 otd with everything i want but i think the Hondas gonna push 18k. If its that much of a better car its probably worth it.
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