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Old 06-02-2008, 10:18 AM   #1
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Acetone testing on a dynamometer

I had said a month or so ago that I was going to test Acetone on the dyno using real flow meters and the EPA's USO6 drivers trace. I hope to get that this next weekend but if not it'll be the weekend after. I'd like to introduce to you the testing plan and see if you guys have any edits from there.

The testing runs will be:
- 2nd gear power pulls from 800-1200rpm to 6500rpm that is ~50rpm before fuel cut. Pulls will be made until the dyno pulls pretty much superimpose on each other(usually only takes about 3).
- 3 1/2 throttle power pull through the above band
- 3 0-60 acceleration pulls
- 3 0-60 1/2 throttle acceleration pulls
- 1 USO6 drivers trace (gasoline baseline will be done 3 times to get a margin of error)


Testing changes between runs:
- Used (Brand) plugs(~25k on them)
- New NGK Copper plugs
- New (Brand) plugs (gasoline baseline)
- 1oz Acetone per 10gal
- 2oz Acetone per 10gal
- 3oz Acetone per 10gal
- 4oz Acetone per 10gal
(The first two runs are for work comparative reasons and may not be posted)

ECU will be reset between runs and the engine WILL NOT be allowed to cool down. I'm going to run the tank dry(probably siphon at the pump) and fill with 15 gallons at the pump. I will be tracking usage from that pump to subtract how much I need to get the acetone concentrations I'll want.

From my experience, if you don't get any part-throttle power gains you don't get gains in fuel economy. I may forgo the part-throttle runs through everything as this is about 6-8 hours of testing as it stands. Part throttle runs also tell me what the engine will do with active timing advance. My PCM only adjusts timing from the default map at WOT if there is knock detected. It won't advance to the edge of knock.

Unfortunately, I won't be able to test straight gas with Acetone vs E10 with Acetone... Not enough time.
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Old 06-02-2008, 11:36 AM   #2
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"Where it counts" for most people will be in the part throttle range, zero to torque peak, between 25% and 50% throttle. So covering that would be optimum.
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Old 06-02-2008, 12:17 PM   #3
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I could make things MUCH easier on myself if I don't do the USO6 trace and hence don't have to use the flow meters and just measure power output at say 10% 15% 25% 50% and 100% throttle. I could then run 0-60 at 25% 35% 50% and 100%

Torque peak on my 2.0L is 3000 rpm so the torque converter stall takes up about 66% of that, usually. I've come up with a way to manually engage the converter clutch, really only for this testing but I'll leave it as a permanent install.
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Old 06-03-2008, 03:34 AM   #4
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How about testing isopropyl alcohol at around 2.5 oz per 10 gallons...along with maybe 2 oz of MMoil per 10.

For mpg testing...I'd say determine your typical throttle opening at 55 mph and do all your testing there....plus maybe an extra 1/3 to 1/2 throttle test for city drving.
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Old 06-20-2008, 10:40 PM   #5
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Results are in.

Well, after a long evening of testing I've got some results for you. First off, I will only be publishing the Wide Open Throttle(WOT) runs. Not only are the results pretty much the same as all of the other runs but WOT means just that, WOT. No other variable that might throw off the results. The engine was more than heat soaked when it got onto the rollers and stayed that way the whole time. The engine was only shut off for the plug replacements along with 4 brand new coil packs installed at the beginning of the testing and to stir the tank with acetone in it.

First things first, I took brand new Bosch Copper plugs, installed them and ran my poor little engine until the results stayed consistent, which after the first run they all pretty much superimposed each other. Then the plugs were pulled and my normal plug of choice was installed(in green) and the results are as follows.


The baseline (with proffered plugs and straight gasoline) were then compared with the acetone runs 1 and 2 to get you This graph, The red line is baseline, green is 1 oz per 10 gal of acetone and the blue is 2 oz.


For additional information we also have 1 oz of acetone in red, 2 oz in green and 3 oz in blue.


To let you in on the part-throttle results. at 50% throttle my engine makes exactly the same amount of torque at 2000 rpm that it does at WOT but the curve is flatter and peaks around 105 ft lbs. At 25% it makes 75 ft lbs at 1800 rpm and quickly falls as the revvs go up.

I was surprised to find that this engine has such a broad torque curve. It starts making over 100 ft lbs of torque around 2250 and keeps it up to about 6500 without any fancy valve timing gizmos.

In conclusion though, straight gasoline with no ethanol doesn't get any performance gains from acetone, no performance gains mean no fuel economy gains. Period.

This most likely is due to the fact that acetone burns slower than gasoline so therefore only works as an effective octane booster. My car doesn't need the extra octane so it didn't see an increase. If I had a Celica GT-S with regular I might see an increase but only in the heavy load range.

Sorry for the quality, photobucket sucks for some reason.
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Old 06-21-2008, 12:41 AM   #6
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Excellent data! Thank you for putting in all the work and diligence.
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Old 06-21-2008, 04:12 AM   #7
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From an old post on a Yahoo group:


[I've done a bit of research on ACETONE as fuel additive for
performance/economy.

From 4 different sources take a pick.

Approx .2% to .25% is suggested.

I also found info that suggest's .75% for octane boost/economy.

1% to 2.5% for blending ethanol/methanol e.t.c and small amounts of
water[approx 1% H2O].

And for racing fuel blends up to 15% Yee Ha!

Acetone is a good surfactant.It's a great fuel blender.It apparently
loves to scavenge/mix H2O into your fuel[good for your steel tank].It
melts plastic and is corrosive in large percentage amounts.

Does it work..Hmmmmmm...well I can vouch for it's power boosting
qualities at .75% to 1% range but as far as economy goes, the speedo
doesn't work.

As its octane rating is approx 150 [by memory] and it's not cheap so
you have to work out your priorities. "aussieburra"]



Here's one you (and I) will find hard to believe....1 oz acetone per gallon:

(Yahoo pes acetone group)

"Just out of curiosity I took it for a hwy test. It got 22.5 hwy.
Factory is 23 so I figured, he must be right about no gain at that
level of acetone. Shortly later, I checked my tire pressure. All
4 tires had 20 some psi in them, way to low. So I filled to 36psi
which is the full amount. Then I retested the car. This time I got
46mpg hwy. This is a 5.0L V8!!!
Then I let an inexperienced
mechanic try to fine tune the car, to see if I could get even more.
He was inexperienced, and messed up the timing. Retarded it below
factory. Tested again. MPG went in the tank. 17mpg hwy. I was
pretty pissed, so adjusted the timing back up to factory myself, and
then, just for the hell of it, as I know this increases horsepower
and mpg, I went just a tad more advance than factory. Tested again."

Just did an emissions test today, to see if the extra advance put
emissions in the tank. It just BARELY increased, still way lower
that straight gas. Advancing timing increases compression pressure,
so you can EXPECT to get dirtier emissions if you do this. It passed
the emissions test with flying colors. And if you think about the
math of it, since it gets (400%?? sic) 100% more mpg, TOTAL parts per million,
>per mile<, is ACTUALLY 1/4 of the reading it gave. Talk about going
GREEN! This is a clean machine. Is a 1985 T-Bird, 5.0L w 4 speed
automatic.


"I will warn you, that no one, including me KNOWS if this will
damage anything. I have been warned by one fellow that it will
cause O2 sensor to misread and make engine run so lean that it
will burn the pistons. I have seen NO SIGN by my temp gauge of
overheating however. I have ran a total of about two 20 gallon
tanks with the 1:128 mixture. Car is running better that ever so
far. Try this at your OWN risk. Much testing is needed on this.
I am in touch with my state senate and a university engineering
dept. The university will be testing for any harmful
emissions or damage to car.

If I don't burn up my engine, my 20 gallon tank now has a range
of 2000miles! LOL, is another junk car. Don't have much in to
it money wise. So if she burns up, no great loss."

..............

I think you are involved in disproving, not testing. Mythbusters syndrome?

Not criticizing what you've done...but I think the real test is VALID on the road mpg testing as per LaPointe...not trying to translate torque/hp curves?
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Old 06-21-2008, 08:26 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZugyNA View Post
I think you are involved in disproving, not testing. Mythbusters syndrome?

Not criticizing what you've done...but I think the real test is VALID on the road mpg testing as per LaPointe...not trying to translate torque/hp curves?
It was testing. If there had been gains I would have posted them. I didn't really care either way I just wanted real data about this. Now, I have a tank of gas that I need to run through that has the acetone in it.

It's completely possible that a car that would do better on higher octane would do better performance and economy wise with acetone. It's unlikely though because a car that requires premium (if it isn't driven hard) usually gets better economy on regular gasoline because of the fact that you are running the fuel on the edge of detonation all the time Your top-end performance does suffer though because it can't run full timing advance.

Who knows, maybe next time I'll come up with a more reliable way to have the throttle stops and I'll test HHO.
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Old 06-21-2008, 08:54 PM   #9
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I haven't tried any of this yet, but the website: http://www.brightgreen.us says that acetone works better with xylene and synthetic motor oil added to the gas as well. I just went there to re-check my earlier research and they are re-designing their website. Hopefully it won't be down to long.
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Old 06-22-2008, 05:49 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkjones96 View Post
Who knows, maybe next time I'll come up with a more reliable way to have the throttle stops and I'll test HHO.
When I was messing with a throttle detent spring on a car...using the same throttle position used at 55 mpg cruise...I found that this position was just a few degrees off idle. The bigger the engine relative to car weight/wind resistance...the less the throttle opening?

With the 5.0 L...I think he just found the right combo of acetone and ignit timing at cruise speed throttle opening. If I had a 5.0 L around the same year I'd already be testing it....but with some MMoil top lube though.

I've never tested 1 oz per gallon.

Here's some acetone testing (not mine) done using a Civic engine tied to a generator and run with a light load...runs timed:

http://www.nonags.org/members/nijqk/chart3.jpg
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