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Old 06-05-2008, 04:30 AM   #31
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the "IDIOT" saying 50-100% increase are all of the web sites selling the things. if you look at the top of this page to the right and to the left, you will find a host of advertisements to "double" your mileage and run your car on water, and the answer to the rising fuel prices.

If you have legitimate results then post them. I work in the engineering field and we like data, and lots of it. show us some testing. if you have something that works then show us. do some A-B-A testing on the thing, start a gas log, pictures would be nice too.

and just a side coment: the phrase 'NO EMISSIONS" is a very bold statement.
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Old 06-05-2008, 04:52 AM   #32
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I can tell you they're idiots

It ain't goin' that high - 50%. I'll give you milege. I'll start posting each week.....watch for an orange 92 harley jeep wrangler on the garage. I was an electronics tech a lifetime ago (navy)....I've been in the tech thing a bit. I do know when my little gas sucker is getting more mpg's, and it certainly is.

I hear you on the emissions thing....Especially with the stupid HHO add's on the site. If I lived in an emissions state I'd post the results of that....that you're not getting. I don't, and I really don't care a lot about it. I'll show you spark plug pictures. You can come sniff the tailpipe if you want. Unless you're bunking with Al Gore, who cares. I want mpg. No emissions is relative. There's no such thing as "no". I'm not here to split hairs. I will show you great gas milege for a murderous gas sucker.

=BEEF;104056]the "IDIOT" saying 50-100% increase are all of the web sites selling the things. if you look at the top of this page to the right and to the left, you will find a host of advertisements to "double" your mileage and run your car on water, and the answer to the rising fuel prices.

If you have legitimate results then post them. I work in the engineering field and we like data, and lots of it. show us some testing. if you have something that works then show us. do some A-B-A testing on the thing, start a gas log, pictures would be nice too.

and just a side coment: the phrase 'NO EMISSIONS" is a very bold statement.[/QUOTE]
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Old 06-05-2008, 04:58 AM   #33
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There's no such thing as "no".
You obviously have not been married for 10+ years!
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Old 06-05-2008, 05:29 AM   #34
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I work for a chip manufacturer as an engineering tech where we design amplifiers for cell phones. efficiency is the key to our business, the higher the better. the efficiency of the generator is partly determined by other members in the stream, not just the efficiency of the generator. how efficient is your motor? what about your alternator? delivery system? there are a lot of factors. I think if the common man could plug up a few wires to a mason jar full of water and see instantaneous results (repeatable results) then it would be happening everywhere.

most of these conversations on the HHO have been started (and usually finished) by people trying to cash in on a quick buck and not caring about the legitimacy of the claims they are making.

if you are getting good results, that's great. if you are willing to share those results, even better. I am not sure how hard it would be or if you are willing to do it but, run a tank with your HHO set up (an entire tank equalling a few hundred miles) and then disconnect your HHO and run without it for a tank (few hundred miles) to see if the mileage goes back down. don't change driving habits durning this experiment. to complet the experiment, hook back up the HHO and do another tank to make sure that other factors have not changed the results.

many of the people that back their claims of the HHO do tests on a half mile stretch or 2 miles. depending on the 2 miles, I can get 100MPG out of the old cav. not consistantly but that is my whole point.
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Old 06-05-2008, 06:25 AM   #35
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I hear you

Funny, I went to selling hot air rework equipment for placing ubga's on pc boards after I left the military.....you probably use them.

I will start posting "with cell" figures tonight. I'm adding a PWM this weekend so I want to keep track of the added hydrogen output when I get it tweeked. Soon after I will turn the unit off and give you figures for that. (after a few weeks). It will be interesting to see how the added hydrogen output effects the mpg.....I'll be able to add more electrolyte so it should go up a bit. Right now I'm between 5-10 amps for the unit....since I drive 5 miles to work, it usually doesn't get hot enough to get to 10 by the time I'm at work.



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Originally Posted by BEEF View Post
I work for a chip manufacturer as an engineering tech where we design amplifiers for cell phones. efficiency is the key to our business, the higher the better. the efficiency of the generator is partly determined by other members in the stream, not just the efficiency of the generator. how efficient is your motor? what about your alternator? delivery system? there are a lot of factors. I think if the common man could plug up a few wires to a mason jar full of water and see instantaneous results (repeatable results) then it would be happening everywhere.

most of these conversations on the HHO have been started (and usually finished) by people trying to cash in on a quick buck and not caring about the legitimacy of the claims they are making.

if you are getting good results, that's great. if you are willing to share those results, even better. I am not sure how hard it would be or if you are willing to do it but, run a tank with your HHO set up (an entire tank equalling a few hundred miles) and then disconnect your HHO and run without it for a tank (few hundred miles) to see if the mileage goes back down. don't change driving habits durning this experiment. to complet the experiment, hook back up the HHO and do another tank to make sure that other factors have not changed the results.

many of the people that back their claims of the HHO do tests on a half mile stretch or 2 miles. depending on the 2 miles, I can get 100MPG out of the old cav. not consistantly but that is my whole point.
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Old 06-05-2008, 01:42 PM   #36
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feedback

Actually I sell guns for a living now....I'm selling nothing HHO....I really don't want to be bothered with the selling thing. I do agree, there are lots of folks bragging about hho but very little hard facts. I believe about 1/10 of what I hear. I've lit the stuff and it goes bang...not poof like gas....if you get it into the air manifold or pvc line it's definately adding fuel.

I have milege figures for about 200 miles but they are skewed with variables. I'll post them anyway. I changed driving habits, air filter, hho added. They're still interesting. Especially the airfilter stuff. The K&N performance air filter killed my mileage.

I'm driving consistantly "old fart" so that's set in stone. With the hho and old fart I'm at 17.25mpg. EPA new car window sticker was 16-19. The jeep has 102,000. miles, a tune up, windjammer, tonoue cover. Stock autolite plugs, gapped at .001 below minumum. New wires. Fairly new cheapo air filter. Tires are 44lbs. in the back and 41 in the front....about 9 lbs over maximum.

I'll post the jeep picture and info tonight. I'm totally open minded to the end results. I have no problem saying it sucks if it does but if I get 2 mpg it's worth it. My skewed figures say I am....we'll get a better feel in the next few weeks. If it doesn't I have a nice dash mounted amp meter, relayed set up for my new fog lights.
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Old 06-05-2008, 03:00 PM   #37
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I used to play with BGA parts (ball grid array) when I worked in ericsson but now I am back to the good old surface mount parts. we are experimenting with flip chips which will make the parts even smaller. I think the spec is 1.2mm square and not sure of the thickness but close to a quarter milimeter. and we are soldering the die straight to the board. no package involved.

I am interested in seeing what an actual non-biased person can get out of this HHO uproar. I call it an uproar because people are making unbelievable claims and the ones saying it can't even explain what is going on with it but they will sell you one for under $200 with free shipping (just an example).

I was hoping that someone would do it on a more fuel efficient vehicle but as of right now, you are the only one that actually said that they would take their experimenting this far. also, as part of the experiment, can you keep up with cost. I am sure that the pulse width modulator is not cheap and maybe I am wrong. are you chopping the 12volts and rectifying it again for a lower voltage to the generator? just curious.

this is the data that a lot of people have been waiting for on this site for a while. remember that non-biased is the key.
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Old 06-05-2008, 03:38 PM   #38
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I've lit the stuff and it goes bang... not poof like gas....if you get it into the air manifold or pvc line it's definately adding fuel.
Gas will do that too if you get it mixed with oxygen like that. You're comparing hydrogen and oxygen at stoich vs gasoline and air at a mixture not even close to stoich.
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Old 06-05-2008, 03:54 PM   #39
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simple

Keep it simple. It goes bang. I'm not comparing anything. I'm saying it is a fuel that has power.

I've listed some stat's on the garage.

It's listed under "rolling box car"





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Gas will do that too if you get it mixed with oxygen like that. You're comparing hydrogen and oxygen at stoich vs gasoline and air at a mixture not even close to stoich.
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Old 06-05-2008, 04:05 PM   #40
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ubga's

I worked for a company in Key Largo that made a machine called the Sniper. It used a prism to align the balls and the pads. It was interesting stuff.

The car info is listed as "rolling box car" on the garage...

I've got probably 300.00 in it so far. I could do it for about 75.00 now. I'd do it differently this time. Use a flat topped water filter container with pre built-in hose connections...they're about 30.00. The PWM modulates the frequency of the pulse. It's listed here http://electronic-light.com/advan.html - 19.95 for the board and components. Shouldn't take more then an hour or so to solder up. The voltage stays at 12v. I didn't do a lot of reseach on it....cheap so grabbed it. The guy seemed up front online.

Believe me you're gonna get it straight. I've got no agenda's. I'll destroy the fuel cell thing online if it doesn't work.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BEEF View Post
I used to play with BGA parts (ball grid array) when I worked in ericsson but now I am back to the good old surface mount parts. we are experimenting with flip chips which will make the parts even smaller. I think the spec is 1.2mm square and not sure of the thickness but close to a quarter milimeter. and we are soldering the die straight to the board. no package involved.

I am interested in seeing what an actual non-biased person can get out of this HHO uproar. I call it an uproar because people are making unbelievable claims and the ones saying it can't even explain what is going on with it but they will sell you one for under $200 with free shipping (just an example).

I was hoping that someone would do it on a more fuel efficient vehicle but as of right now, you are the only one that actually said that they would take their experimenting this far. also, as part of the experiment, can you keep up with cost. I am sure that the pulse width modulator is not cheap and maybe I am wrong. are you chopping the 12volts and rectifying it again for a lower voltage to the generator? just curious.

this is the data that a lot of people have been waiting for on this site for a while. remember that non-biased is the key.
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