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Old 10-30-2006, 01:06 PM   #51
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Good question Metro, I need to order a supermid. I am going off of my tank to tank info for now. Its hard to keep up with all the things my car needs. I still need a 5 wire o2 (mine is shot), the EGR box, and an alignment so i dont kill the Potenza's.

With all I have done to the car lately I have somewhat expected a FE gain, but my averages seem to be leveling off, Maybe due to outside temps.

Thanks for the info on the gorilla glue Nonnef, I may try that. Is it more like super glue, or a silicone type of glue?
I have also thought about tapeing the leading edges like Jangeo said, because the edge did not sit as flush as i would have thought. Which could lead to more of them flying off.


I will let you know how these turn out and post some pictures.
I also need to post pics of the LED brake lights since i havent done that.
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Old 10-30-2006, 02:11 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FormulaTwo
Good question Metro, I need to order a supermid. I am going off of my tank to tank info for now. Its hard to keep up with all the things my car needs. I still need a 5 wire o2 (mine is shot), the EGR box, and an alignment so i dont kill the Potenza's.

With all I have done to the car lately I have somewhat expected a FE gain, but my averages seem to be leveling off, Maybe due to outside temps.
Your throwing your money at the wrong things. I know there expensive but fix the O2 sensor that will give you a better FE increase (10-15%) then air tab and LLR tires combined not to mention that the environment will thank you to.
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Old 10-30-2006, 02:51 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zpiloto
Your throwing your money at the wrong things. I know there expensive but fix the O2 sensor that will give you a better FE increase (10-15%) then air tab and LLR tires combined not to mention that the environment will thank you to.

Agreed, although the tires i did not have a choice. Considering the ones I had went completely bald due to my crappy alignment. So now the alignment is my #1 priority.

The EGR box I have to go pick up about an hour from here, but havent yet.

The o2 sensor will soon follow. If I see a 10 to 15% increase off of the O2 sensor then I will be amazed. Im pretty sure the car is not going into lean burn since the ECU is seeing the o2 error, and adjusting the fuel for safety.

If any of you guys know of places to get deals on 5 wire o2's, let me know. I am going for NGk most likely, i hear bosch are crap.
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Old 10-30-2006, 03:44 PM   #54
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The Gorilla glue is a urethane glue that reacts with moisture and foams up - I don't think that is what you want to use - maybe a good rubber cement or even silicone adhesive which will not damage the paint with some overlap but I don't think that it will stand up to water and rain and snow. The real problem is that all Glue is temporary and since the Airtabs are probably ABS plastic you have the other problem of using something that will stick to that also. Maybe some 3M spray adhesive. . .
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Old 10-30-2006, 04:22 PM   #55
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How about pop-rivets or sheet metal screws? (just kiddin')

But if you're just doing test, what about duct tape?
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Old 10-30-2006, 07:32 PM   #56
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Alright well, here we go.....


I decided to reinstall them using 3m tape, like what is used on vent visors etc...
We have plenty of this at my work for me to play around with.

I tried it out on one just to see how high the airtab would actually sit with the 3m tape under it. It did not exactly sit flush, but definitely a good strong hold.

I took electrical tape and taped off the front edges, and part of the sides. This should smooth out airflow onto the airtab, and maybe hold the tab a little better.

So far so good, it looks a little awkward only having 3 tabs installed right in the middle of the rear of the car.

To be installed correctly I will actually need 4 more.
They say to install them 4" from center to center. No more than 10 inches from the rear of the vehicle.


Honestly I do not feel must difference in the car on the highway. I know there have been reports of increased stability etc... Then again there are only 3 up there, which probably wouldn't do too much if these things worked anyway.

I may tape some tufts all over the rear of the car this weekend, so I can get an idea of what the air is doing back there.
I will need someone to help with this, maybe video tape- take pictures...


from what i read.....

# Tufts that move around chaotically are a sign of drag.
# Tufts that move in the direction opposite to the airflow are a sign of high drag.
# Tufts that stay in line with the airflow are a sign of lower drag.

anything else to look for?
I will def post pics when i get them

Too bad none of you FE guys are from around here.
Could start up our own backyard FE skunkworks.
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Old 10-31-2006, 05:12 AM   #57
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Try driving in fog or a dusty road I heard the vortex is really easy to see at 40mph and up. Put one on your hood?
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Old 10-31-2006, 09:17 AM   #58
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FormulaTwo -

Quote:
Originally Posted by FormulaTwo
Alright well, here we go.....


I decided to reinstall them using 3m tape, like what is used on vent visors etc...
We have plenty of this at my work for me to play around with.

I tried it out on one just to see how high the airtab would actually sit with the 3m tape under it. It did not exactly sit flush, but definitely a good strong hold.

I took electrical tape and taped off the front edges, and part of the sides. This should smooth out airflow onto the airtab, and maybe hold the tab a little better.

So far so good, it looks a little awkward only having 3 tabs installed right in the middle of the rear of the car.

To be installed correctly I will actually need 4 more.
They say to install them 4" from center to center. No more than 10 inches from the rear of the vehicle.


Honestly I do not feel must difference in the car on the highway. I know there have been reports of increased stability etc... Then again there are only 3 up there, which probably wouldn't do too much if these things worked anyway.
I am guessing that you need to start from a crummy aerodynamic place to begin with, like a Semi, in order to feel improvement. Also, the Semi's in the pictures are *covered* with them at the end. The one picture of the Honda CRV might be what you should look to accomplish.

I wonder if you can do a before/after coast test. It will be hard to keep things equal unless you have a "perfect road" to work with. Test must be done with same prevailing wind/temp/humidity conditions.

Quote:

I may tape some tufts all over the rear of the car this weekend, so I can get an idea of what the air is doing back there.
I will need someone to help with this, maybe video tape- take pictures...


from what i read.....

# Tufts that move around chaotically are a sign of drag.
# Tufts that move in the direction opposite to the airflow are a sign of high drag.
# Tufts that stay in line with the airflow are a sign of lower drag.

anything else to look for?
I will def post pics when i get them

Too bad none of you FE guys are from around here.
Could start up our own backyard FE skunkworks.
I would really appreciate seeing your "Tuft Setup" in order to see how to set that up.

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Old 10-31-2006, 12:50 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cfg83
It will be hard to keep things equal unless you have a "perfect road" to work with. Test must be done with same prevailing wind/temp/humidity conditions.
Don't forget fully warmed up drivetrain/tires. (Takes much longer than the engine does to reach stable operating temps.)

--

Coincidentally, someone loaned me a box full of air tabs yesterday. So I'll also be running an airtab test sometime in Nov.
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Old 10-31-2006, 02:10 PM   #60
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I was thinking of molding the air tabs into a rear spoiler and then add the spoiler to the top of my xB rear hatch. They wouldn't blow off that way.
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