WAI vs CAI test results - Page 2 - Fuelly Forums

Android Users - Coming Soon! - Migrating from aCar 4.8 to 5.0

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 01-12-2006, 02:45 PM   #11
*shrug*
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 6,195
Country: United States
Hmm, all I can say as a

Hmm, all I can say as a starting point is that the older honda ecus do not do that, I will poke around for you though.
__________________

SVOboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2006, 02:54 PM   #12
Registered Member
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,223
Country: United States
more notes on methodology &

more notes on methodology & test conditions:

* an A-B-A-B test method was used: 3 CAI runs; then 3 WAI runs; then 2 more CAI; then one final WAI

* when switching between A and B, the car was driven for 10 minutes to allow the intake tract to either cool down or warm up to a steady temperature before returning to the "test course"

* i used about 6.9L of fuel during the test, so the car got lighter by that amount from run 1 through run 9 (plus the cool down/warm up drives_.

* the ambient conditions were as follows, based on info from an online weather station located several km from the "test road" location.

time....wind-dir...wind...gust...temp-F

12pm......ssw.......10.....10......39
01pm......ssw........8......8......38.1
02pm......ssw........7......7......39.6

(wind data in knots; the test went from approx noon to 2pm.)

* the car was warmed up prior to the test: block heater 1.5 hrs & 30 minutes of mixed city/hwy driving
__________________

MetroMPG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2006, 02:58 PM   #13
Registered Member
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,223
Country: United States
Re: Hmm, all I can say as a

Quote:
Originally Posted by SVOboy
Hmm, all I can say as a starting point is that the older honda ecus do not do that
sorry, don't do what, specifically?

matt: cool analysis. where do i get me some of that program?? i was just using the STDEV function in excel and a formula I found on a stats web site. it's close enough to the figure your program gave you for std error and std deviation for the CAI group.
MetroMPG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2006, 03:02 PM   #14
*shrug*
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 6,195
Country: United States
Adjust timing based on

Adjust timing based on anything besides knock, and then they don't even do that unless they are japanese.
SVOboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2006, 03:04 PM   #15
Registered Member
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,223
Country: United States
not even vacuum advance?

not even vacuum advance? surely timing is controlled by something dynamically.

my car doesn't have a knock sensor. and i'm running enough base timing advance that i have to be careful not to mat it at low rpm or it will ping.
MetroMPG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2006, 03:06 PM   #16
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,978
Country: United States
A couple things...

With the WAI -- do you have a way to get the actual temperature of the air? I'd venture a guess that cold air is slipping into the mix somehow.

To answer the OBD2 question, my '98 Honda (Acura) ECU leans-out the mixture with the detection of warmer air, as shown from a datalogger. With the CAI on there, I was getting an average of -2 to -3 long-term fuel trim, whereas the WAI ranges in the -4 to -6 range. Economy was instantly noted to increase from around 26 to 31. Timing advance is all over the place, so I can't really report any changes in that department. There is a definite decrease in horsepower, especially at higher RPMs, as shown in 0-60 times. Merging onto the highway, if I have to floor it, seems like it's choked-off struggling to get to redline. Have you noticed a decrease in power?

RH77
__________________
rh77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2006, 03:07 PM   #17
*shrug*
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 6,195
Country: United States
Ah, well I took vac advance

Ah, well I took vac advance for granted. Timing is on a big table with the variables being load levels and rpms.
SVOboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2006, 03:09 PM   #18
Driving on E
 
Matt Timion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,110
Country: United States
Re: Hmm, all I can say as a

Quote:
Originally Posted by MetroMPG
Quote:
Originally Posted by SVOboy
Hmm, all I can say as a starting point is that the older honda ecus do not do that
sorry, don't do what, specifically?

matt: cool analysis. where do i get me some of that program?? i was just using the STDEV function in excel and a formula I found on a stats web site. it's close enough to the figure your program gave you for std error and std deviation for the CAI group.
I used SPSS to get my results. I was trained on SPSS and some other old powerful command line program that everyone still uses (can't remember the name now).

I might be able to swing you a copy of SPSS. I think I have one around here somewhere. I think it is generally used for behavioral research but any statistics can be run using it.

I was originally planning on programming all of this into the website and letting users simply input data and then have teh website spew out the results. I'm sure I could still do that, although it would take a while to do.
Matt Timion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2006, 03:31 PM   #19
Registered Member
 
Compaq888's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,460
Country: United States
Re: A couple things...

Quote:
Originally Posted by rh77
With the WAI -- do you have a way to get the actual temperature of the air? I'd venture a guess that cold air is slipping into the mix somehow.

To answer the OBD2 question, my '98 Honda (Acura) ECU leans-out the mixture with the detection of warmer air, as shown from a datalogger. With the CAI on there, I was getting an average of -2 to -3 long-term fuel trim, whereas the WAI ranges in the -4 to -6 range. Economy was instantly noted to increase from around 26 to 31. Timing advance is all over the place, so I can't really report any changes in that department. There is a definite decrease in horsepower, especially at higher RPMs, as shown in 0-60 times. Merging onto the highway, if I have to floor it, seems like it's choked-off struggling to get to redline. Have you noticed a decrease in power?

RH77
I have to quote on this. i used to have a WAI and I will tell you I lost a lot of low end with it. I didn't gain any mpg either. All that happened was I gained a lot of top end. I had an Injen WAI. My mpg stayed the same. The best mpg I'm getting is with the stock intake system. As for the top end I lost .4 in the 1/4 mile thanks to the Injen WAI. that is not .04, but .4, which is almost half a second.
__________________

Compaq888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2006, 03:33 PM   #20
Registered Member
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,223
Country: United States
Re: A couple things...

Quote:
Originally Posted by rh77
With the WAI -- do you have a way to get the actual temperature of the air?
yup, from the air intake temp sensor (inside the throttle body i think) - via scangauge.

Quote:
To answer the OBD2 question, my '98 Honda (Acura) ECU leans-out the mixture with the detection of warmer air, as shown from a datalogger.
yeah, i'm starting to realize that to go really hardcore, a scangauge doesn't cut it. i need something to hook to the laptop to gather data for experiments, and the scangauge for normal driving. SG doesn't report fuel trim, so i can't report on those figures.

Quote:
Have you noticed a decrease in power?
my car feels gutless at the best of times

i haven't stuck my foot in it to see if i notice any difference. this car doesn't encourage (or reward) that kind of driving. though i may have felt it bog down a little the other day when the AIT showed that it was really warm.
__________________

MetroMPG is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Can't delete fill ups posted by a friend. missmaispace Fuelly Web Support and Community News 4 08-18-2014 10:18 PM
ODO in km, wrong unit... ProDigit Fuelly Web Support and Community News 1 10-19-2012 01:07 PM
Engine size?! DuckFeet Fuelly Web Support and Community News 1 04-25-2012 10:58 PM
Average mpg + tracked km even though fuel-ups marked as missed Pelle Fuelly Web Support and Community News 14 03-04-2012 04:10 AM
Incorrect Milage Calcuatlion PatM Fuelly Web Support and Community News 4 07-17-2009 08:21 PM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 09:12 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.