Left foot braking anyone?
 

Hey ya'll I've been lurking for a while now. I was reading up on drafting be cause I love to draft. I'm one of those *******s who draft >6 Feet away.

I only do this because I practice left foot braking, that is braking with my left. I find that I brake at the very least .75 seconds faster than with just my right. This is primarily a automatic driving technique. Anyone else here use it?

I used to teach people how to drive emergency vehicles, and was in charge of approving people to drive for my squad. If I caught someone left foot braking they were immediately suspended from driving. The drivers that were doing that were overheating the brakes and cracking rotors. Not only that but it was also unsafe because the brake lights stayed on and nobody knew if the vehicle was stopping or not.

Its not safe, and you can do some serious damage to your vehicle and/or increase your chance of being rear-ended because your brake lights keep coming on when you're not stopping.

-jay

:confused: Whenever I have to drive an autotragic I always left foot brake. I have never experienced any of those issues and it has not increased my chances of getting rear ended. Just put your left foot on the foot rest when you are not braking and you won't experience any of those problems.

I would say that if done properly, left foot braking is much safer than right foot braking (for automatics of course) due to a quicker reaction time. Instead of lifting off the gas and then moving your right foot over, all you have to do is quickly slam on the brake with the left foot. Getting on the brakes sooner means you come to a stop sooner.

I remember reading an article where a highly respected source tested race car drivers on a track and found the lap times of those who left foot braked to be much better than those who used right foot braking.

Left foot braking will make you a much better driver and the new sensitivity and feel you develop with your left foot will result with much better clutch feel and modulation when you drive a manual.

Definitely keep up with your left foot braking and I highly suggest that everyone at least try and experiment with it.

Two feet for two pedals, makes sense to me. Why have the right foot do everything and do nothing with the left?

woah, what? What does left foot braking have to do with riding the brakes???

Jay, left foot braking and riding the brake with your left foot are two very different things. One is race inspired the other is lazy inspired. I use left foot braking to maintain a throttle position entering a turn at high speed while slowing down, without the on-off jerk of moving the right foot from one pedal to the next. I also use it gently to turn off the cruise on uphills, again to maintain a constant throttle position, but for FE not speed.

Easy with the knee jerk reaction to misused terms.

I too always left foot brake, specially when driving an automagic trans.
What I do not do is leave my left foot on the pedal.

I find it more comfortable to use my left foot, plus having owned only manual transmissions (until now :( ) I need my left foot to do something other then fall asleep.

I use LFB, but only to counter understeer. I do it much less since I've been hypermiling.

No heel/toe people here?

My leg is not flexible enough for "proper" heel/toe, but I can brake & rev match if the need arises. Again, hypermiling cuts down on the need for that kind of thing. Some days I slip back into my old habits just for fun.

When I drove my granmother's old 81 AMC Spirit with a 4 speed manual I'd heel/toe to prevent the car from rolling backwards when I started from a hill. I'd operate the clutch with my left foot, right heel on the brake, right toe on the accelerator. As I brought the clutch up I would slowly give it more gas, as I was releasing the brake. I never rolled back.

The problem with left foot braking is that the drivers that did it would have the left foot hover by the brake. This invariably ended up with them bumping the brake when they didn't intend to, and probably don't realize as well.

I was responsible for the vehicle maintenance and driver training for a fleet of 2 Ford E 350 ambulances, 1 Ford E 450 Super Duty Ambulance, 1 International DT 4700 ambulance, 1 Chevy K 3500 ambulance, and 1 Chevy S-10 Blazer. I didn't like spending my maintenance budget on buying brakes. Sometimes a brake job would only last 2 or 3 months before someone cracked the rotors again.

Also consider that left foot braking gives the patient a better ride instead of a constant gas-brake jerky ride.

-Jay

left foot braking is dangerous for one main reason.

In a panic situation when you need to SLAM ON THE BRAKES, there's a high likelyhook you'll actually mash both the gas pedal and the brake pedal since you're not making the usual transition with the right leg over the brake pedal in your everyday driving technique.

When I'm driving, if I'm not accelerating, my right leg is hovering over the brake pedal. No acceptions. That's what the "dead pedal" is for in an automatic afterall... rest your left leg there, while in an automatic, your left leg is not to be used.


Also - left foot brakers do have a tendancy to ride the brakes, I've observed many times, a commercial vehicle (or company vehicle) w/ the brake lights on while accelerating... I then proceed to dial the "how's my driving" number and report them as left-foot-brakers... which unless you drive a postal truck, is probably NOT VERY SAFE.

Left foot and right foot braking is learned. It's either learned well or not. Some can't even drive well, period.

There's no propensity for the right foot to be necessarily better at using the brake than the left, but an individual trying to do that task, left foot braking, on an irregular basis isn't going to be good at it as they are with their normal operations.

Sure sign of a rank amateur. There is nothing faster or safer about it. :thumbdown:

Jim T.

Left foot, right foot, doesn't seem to be a concious decision on my part. When I need to slow or stop at least one of my feet find the brake pedal without my thinking about it.
Interestingly, when I drive a manaul transmission and the left foot is dedicated to the clutch pedal, there has never been that instant of hesitation to also simultaneously and subconciously move the right foot over to the brake in the middle while the left pressed the clutch, yet driving an automatic transmission there has never been a move to slide the right foot over to the middle because the left foot is at work.

Easy solution to the pedal riders: Make the brake switch command the fuel injectors to idle flow. Both of my diesels do this anyway, makes trail brake oversteer when autocrossing more difficult, but keeps both Grampas and E.M.T. drivers honest.

And why is the word "ambidextrous", not "ambisinistrous"?

Gas engines don't tolerate lean mixtures like diesels do.

Tell THAT to honda with their lean burn technology.

Ok, I should have added "(except for Honda's 1990s Civic VX lean burn engine and GM's DI V6)".

Honda has other vehicles that have lean burn such as the insight manual hybrid and a few others.

Now now, be nice to me! I'm an amateur!

Honestly, dont ride the brakes if there is not need to quick braking I rest left away from the brakes. In highway traffic I hover my left like 1cm above the brakes.

And I have been in many emergency situations before. I slam the brakes with my as I am releasing the accelerator. As your learn LFB releasing the the acc as you brake becomes muscle memory.

are you crazy?????
 

I'm new also, and don't mean to flame-------buuuuuuttttttttttt

A few weeks ago several drivers attempted your driving style on a PUBLIC highway. In a 55mph construction zone, barrier-ed all up on both sides, no where to go, two lanes, no shoulder. The last vehicle in a row of 6-10 was a TRIPLE TRAILER TRUCK. The first was a SEMI. I guess they were all in a hurry.

Result??

Two DEAD, four injured.

Unless you have some majic spell you can cast on the fools behind you, what you set up in front of you can/will affect you. The two dead were at the FRONT of the car-train. They achieved ultimate economy for the rest of us.
They consume nothing now.

Leave race inspired tactics/style at the track, with equal ability drivers.

Illegal/stupid/dangerous driving in public provides no long term benefit.

Welcome to the forum, Blkzr1. Please quote someone before you go off on them like that. I thought you were blaming that accident on left-foot-brakers, and was writing a reply until I decided it was too messed up and reviewed the thread.

Most people who draft effectively don't get anywhere near that close. It's too close for a good draft, probably due to turbulence and such; regardless, it's rude and (most importantly) dangerous.

A lucky coincidence is that the most effective drafting distance, as observed and measured by a few members of this forum, is around 3 seconds -- a safe distance.

Left foot braking has saved me from death or serious injury on at least half a dozen occasions, including a potential t bone where the other person ran a red light at 45 MPH.

regards
gary

Do this in Virginia and you will become a habitual offender in about 18 months=no license for 10 years.

regards
gary

soo the general consensus is that left foot braking be left to those who know how to use it properly. Good. To those who don't know how to use it effectively and are here complaining: shut up. You don't practice it, you don't know how to use it. To those who "practice" it but just suck at driving: well, there's little hope for you changing your driving habits, so keep up the crappy job.

Sure are some strong opinions here.


Here is a post on the subject, including two events involving emergency braking, that might be of interest:

10-07-2008, 11:42 PM
shatto
2006 Toyota Tundra
Last Online: Today 12:08 PM
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Concord, San Francisco Bay Area
Posts: 61
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Scary Good Brakes - Part II

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I used to have so many people cutting in front of me to get to the upcoming off-ramp that I got in the habit of looking in the rear view mirror, and, sure enough lots of room behind me! Got to be my private inside joke with my wife....about the sign on the back that said; "Cut Me Off!"

My Tundra is different, in a scary way.

Monday, I was going from the San Francisco-Oakland Bay Bridge onto Highway 24, to Walnut Creek when I was cut off.
I was carrying around 500 pounds, was in the left of two off-ramp lanes in 45 MPH traffic when.........the guy in the Accord in the right lane decided he was on the wrong highway and turned left......in front of the guy in front of me (did you see the Talladega stock car race? 195 MPH and somebody slips in-between with inches to spare?) I hit the brakes, thinking "Pretty good brakes" then, next I knew I was in the right lane, mashing the throttle into the front suspension and looking into the right mirror, I hope to god for the second time not the first, and seeing the Rodeo superimposed on the grill of the Peterbilt!
I noticed , as the Tundra accelerated smartly away, the Accord driving over the median and onto the 580 Freeway; then around a mile away the Rodeo pulled alongside... I turned to apologise and there, with the cigarette jutting like FDR, was a grinning Oriental giving me a "thumbs up!"

************************************************** ************************************************** *************
Then there was Tuesday;

I had a pallet with 850 lbs of the liquid used for home dialysis, tucked right up against the front of the bed and was driving in evening traffic on Capitol Expressway, in San Jose when..........say it with me, the guy in the right lane turned left in front of me.
I was thinking to myself; "darn good brakes! I've still got lots left."
After I delivered the load I had to reset the shell because the top of the load had shifted and pushed it into the cab.

I've got to remove that darn sign!

************************************************** ***********--------------------------------------------------------------------------************************************************** ************

Shatto,

Your stories don't seem to mention which foot you use for braking. However, you should expect to easily get as much braking power as your tires can handle, since your truck's braking system was designed to provide decent performance for braking twice the weight that it had to brake under those conditions. You probably have at least a 2,000 pound dead tow rating, and a 10,000 pound rating for trailers with electric or surge brakes (which are not expected to provide 100% of the trailer's braking).

Thank you for asking.
A short story to cover 'Heel/Toe' and 'Left Foot Braking' might set my bona-fides.

But first;
*I see lots of people who rest their foot on the brake pedal.
*There are people not very good using the brakes, no matter which foot they use.
*Some vehicles have such minimal brakes, they can't handle heavy duty use.
*The dumbest use of brakes is the Prius driver I saw on the freeway who applied the brakes every 15 seconds to charge the battery.

I spent fifteen years living in Ethiopia, where I helped my father build and run Shatto Safaris. I drove; flat head and F-head Jeeps, 88, 109 and Forward Control Land Rovers, Unimogs, An M-37 and M-38, Land Cruisers and a 1934 Fiat Millecento. Most driving was on gravel roads degrading to cross country, sometimes through Elephant Grass that quickly removed all the paint and turned the entire undercarriage silver. Once, we were caught in a sea of mud after a storm that clogged the wheel wells and required the Jeep and Land Rover to pull...drag one trailer and that meant driving for hours at a stretch in 2nd gear, low-range at maximum throttle. Driving fully loaded vehicles in those conditions requires learning to 'heel-toe' as a matter of survival.

In the early 60's I visited my grandmother in San Francisco.

You 'oldsters' remember the ad's for Pontiac, I think it was, that showed a woman's foot in high heels a wall-to-wall brake pedal and, between, an egg?

I was driving my gram in her big new Chrysler, and we came to a light so I slowed to a stop. And pushed in the clutch. Bam! Bounced her off the dash board!
I have left foot braked ever since, when driving an automatic.
The Tundra is new to me. The 98 Dakota (automatic) went 623,000 miles and the Sonoma (automatic) 260,000 miles.
Left foot braking is no longer an intellectual concept to me.
And I can shift a manual without using the clutch.

I'm amazed that there wasn't more focus on the outright dangerous practice of close-in drafting. This is the truly dangerous part of what's being described here. It's just not worth it to be that close to anyone no matter how much fuel it saves.:mad:

When you turn on the headlights to allow a truck to change into your lane, they'll soon figure out you know what you are doing.
If you tuck up behind a semi, he won't care for a bunch of reasons, not the least being any contact from the rear is not his fault, so I'm going to guess he doesn't even care if you know what you're doing.

People who commute get to know each other by sight. Doesn't take long for the group to figure out driving styles and who knows what they're doing.
I was once cut off by a pickup. A few seconds later a guy on a Harley pulled next to the truck, kicked the door and verbally laid into the driver. The pickup left the freeway at the next exit.
You don't want to tick-off travelling buddies.

Then......there is the law.

Go ahead draft.

Drove from Williamsbug to Richmond today on I64 West. Traffic was moderate but in groups of idiots that followed at 2 car lengths at 70+ MPH. Gaps between these groups of hundreds of yards, yet the idiots still risk their lives for nothing.

I was in the right lane going 65 and one moron passed me on the right in an acceleration lane. He was not entering the highway. I gave him a one finger salute.

When crowded the average distance between cars is probably 5 car lengths at 70 MPH. I am not exaggerating. I have watched idiots changing lanes trying to pass people on the right only to get caught there and loose a lot of relative distance. Watched one idiot do this for 40 miles to gain 200 yards distance relative to the rest of the drivers.

I drove home on old Route 60 parallel to the interstate at 55 MPH, on a deserted road. Probably only saw twenty other cars going the same direction in 45 miles.

If you don't draft on this stretch of interstate the weavers will make you draft. The danger is exponential to rational driving techniques.

Driving a VX in these situations requires extreeme defensive skills, because you are definitely the smaller marble.

I did see a lot of troopers writing tickets. It seems with the falling gas prices the idiots are returning to their old stupid habits.

The safest place for me in these circumstances is 3 stripes behind a big rig.

regards
badger

Actually I would atribute that to being alert, not being a LFBA.
I've avoided many accidents in 28 years of driving, and always with my right foot. This proves nothing.

Jim T.

The only time I have ever used anything but the ball of my right foot to brake was when I used to drive a stick shift. (Advantage: big feet). I would operate the clutch with my left foot, and have my right heel on the brake, and my toe on the accelerator. As I brought the clutch up I would angle my right foot, effectively releasing the brake as I gave it some gas. I never rolled backwards. Even then I was using my right foot on the brake.

42 years driving here.

Jim T if you had been in the car you would have no doubt.

I have none and I was there.

regards
gary

It still proves NOTHING. Left foot braking saves no time that is measurable. You think it's better because you think it saved your ***. It did nothing that driving normally and being vigilant would not have. :rolleyes: You're perception is you're reality, and yours is, well just wrong.

Oh, btw, sometimes that right foot got me out of trouble with the throttle, not the brake, try THAT while your left foot has the brake mashed to the floor.

Jim T.

I drive with just one hand on the steering wheel now. I don't want to risk the chance of going straight into a tree as one hand moves clockwise and the other counterclockwise!
Makes as much sense as claiming I operate both feet simultaneously. I'm not a Kangaroo. I can alternate.
Sometimes I also alternate between being civil and matching idiocy.
Guess which I chose this time?

What is your maximum deceleration rate?
What is you maximum acceleration rate?
I dare say that if acceleration is the safer means of avoiding a collision (with the sole exception of from behind) then your brakes are defective.

So, taking common sense and twisting it all out of context makes it alright?

My Mazdaspeed3's gas and brake are only 2 inches apart. If you put both feet on the pedals your stepping on your own feet, unless your's are childrens size 5's? ;)
You can try to justify bad habits by whatever rational you wish.
They're still bad habits.
And there is NO drivers manual or drivers education book that advocates it.

Jim T.

And I would explain the situation that accelerating saved my bacon, but you probably wouldn't get it.

It is not a bad habit.

The technique itself is great and has been proven many times to be superior. The problem is that not everyone has learned how to execute the technique properly. You can't use a few bad drivers as an example and declare that because of this no one can properly do it.

It is like blaming a plane for a crash when the cause was proven to be operator error.

Besides that there seems to be a lot of arrogance on the part of those who choose not to educate themselves and question their preconceived notions.

Where is the proof of this??? :confused: :confused:

Proven to be superior to what, braking with your right hand and a wooden spoon?

And show me where it?s a written or approved technique in any drivers manual and I'll believe your BS.

Otherwise keep your stupid comments about "arrogonce and education" to yourself.

Jim T.

I can say that I work on live 120v and 240v circuits (which I do on occasion) and that its far superior because its easier to troubleshoot a live circuit. Its also better because I don't have to constantly run up & down stairs to turn breakers on & off, so I get done much quicker. My logic that its better is based on the fact that it hasn't killed or seriously injuerd me... yet.

No professional drivers are taught LFB, save for maybe NASCAR. Even then, its on a track, with other professional drivers, and all the vehicles on that track are in top mechanical condition and built so that in all likelihood a driver will emerge from an accident with little or no injury. If you worked as a professional driver for just about any large company such as a trucking firm, bus company, limo company, FedEX, UPS, ETC, and they found out you were LFB you'd probably be pulled off the road and sent to drivers training again. If you got caught again you'd probably be fired. If you were involved in an accident and it was determined that you were LFB, it would not look good on you in court, and your employer knows this. They don't want you jacking up their insurance rates. Employers have enough expenses to worry about.

On the public highways you have drivers of various ability levels, vehicles built to different quality and safety standards, varying states of disrepair. Throw in someone doing strange stuff that isn't taught in any drivers ed class and its a recipe for disaster. Just because you haven't been in an accident because of this doesn't mean its safe.

I don't advocate LFB, I use it for an advantage to offset age and slower reaction times, and to protect myself from others who drive like idiots.

Jim T, I only have to prove anything to me, what you think about me or my methods means diddly.

Drive any way you like and when you make a stupid mistake and I avoid the wreck you would cause, then you can THANK me for saving your arse.

Kohote is not the only one who thinks your responses are arrogant.

The original post was asking if anyone used left foot braking. I do. No other member of my extended family does, but every member would rather ride with me driving than drive themselves.

I had a cop tell me it would get me a ticket to pull out into an intersection to keep some idiot from hitting me in the rear end. I told him I would let the judge decide whether my actions were legal or not. If my life is threatened by anothers stupidity or belligerance. I am damn sure not waiting for the damage to be done, and I am a quadriplegic.

Drive any way you want, I could care less, until the instant when you affect my safety, then you have crossed the boundary of civilized conduct, and the response is my perogative. Rest assured I will never threaten you in any way on any highway on the planet, and I expect the same in return.

In almost 1 million miles no person has ever been injured riding in a car with me. Can you make the same statement? If so the WE need to worry about the other idiots.

regards
gary