Gas Price Fraud?
 

Apr 22, 2011
Federal Taskforce Focuses on Gas Price Fraud

WASHINGTON -- As gas prices creep closer to the $5 point, the Justice Department is taking the reins in the battle against fraud and manipulation at the pump.

Speaking at a renewable energy plant on Thursday, President Barack Obama said U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder was putting together the Financial Fraud Enforcement Working Group, according to the Associated Press. "We are going to make sure that no one is taking advantage of the American people for their own short-term gain," Obama said.

However, Holder has suggested legal reasons may be behind the increase in gas pumps, which is reaching $4 in some states and have almost hit the $5 mark in others. "Based upon our work and research to date, it is evident that there are regional differences in gasoline prices, as well as differences in the statutory and other legal tools at the government's disposal," Holder said in a memo accompanying the task force announcement. "It is also clear that there are lawful reasons for increases in gas prices, given supply and demand.

"Nonetheless, where consumers are harmed by unlawful conduct that has the effect of increasing gas prices, state and federal authorities will take swift action," he added.

According to the news outlet, the national average price per of a gallon of regular gas was $3.84 on Thursday, the day of the announcement. That price is approximately 30 cents higher than a month ago and almost $1 higher than a year ago.

Despite the pump prices taking a turn in the national spotlight, Obama has acknowledged there may not be much he can do about the price of gas in the short term. As the news outlet reported, gas prices have been on a steady incline because of tensions in the Middle East and northern Africa, and growing demand in emerging economies like China.

https://www.csnews.com/top-story-federal_task_forces_focuses_on_gas_price_fraud-58570.html

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

i imagine holder and the goons will look to the sky and then proclaim there's either no shenanigans or there's nothing to be done about it legally.

once again, tough decisions can't be made.

politics is the primary reason...but we can't discuss it.

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

Why deal with our own over consumption problem when you can speculate about conspiracy theories instead.

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

^Ha ha, yup!

The Fraud Group is a fraud. The govt knows damn well where the money is going. This is just a dog and pony show to make it appear to the public that they are doing something. It will never amount to a hill of beans.

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

hopefully..otherwise it might turn into a witch hunt and be an excuse for a govt. take over of the oil companies..

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

All of the world's largest oil companies are government owned so why not? Bring some sanity to this 'market'.
https://www.petrostrategies.org/Links...anies_2008.gif

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

It's the speculators too.

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

Yeah, all those people with online trading accounts that don't know what they're doing buying oil futures. If a lot of people buy futures, the price we pay now goes up, the higher it gets, more people want to buy futures. Its a vicious cycle that should be changed.

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

If you're implying that the government is "sane", then you're sorely mistaken.. If anything, I would blame the governments of foreign countries for being the problem.


Yeah, how dare people participate in a free market! You're right, that should be changed, and instead we should go with a government regulated economy where in the bid of short term relief, they'll keep prices at unsustainable low levels before there is either an unexpected "pop" or a complete meltdown and catastrophic shock to the supply demand equation, something that could literally cause chaos. Free markets are good, even in the most extreme negative examples of what some call "price gouging" because in such a scenario, resources are allocated only to those who absolutely need it and have no alternative. For those who do have an alternative, they'll slowly migrate to that alternative. This also prevents people from "hoarding" because the price of the given commodity would make no sense to hoard unless there was upward pressure on pricing. This idea might conjure up ideas of cartels like debeers but in true free markets where the government isn't involved, cartels like debeers simply cannot exist and so no singular entity would have complete control over the commodity. The long term trade for oil is that it's a resource that is having more pressure applied to it, that the smallest disruption could mean skyrocketing prices because of the change in the supply demand equation. People are very short term focused and so attempting measures to artificially drive down the price of fuel despite data suggesting a needed price increase is only going to make things more distorted and more volatile when there is in fact an actual shortage of fuel.

If the idea of expensive gasoline frightens you, then you all should begin contingency plans for either living without the need for gasoline or for at least living with a significantly reduced amount of gasoline compared to your current usage levels.

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

Riiight, blame the speculators. Never mind the millions of new drivers being added to the roads of China and India every year.

Yeah, they provide the vast majority of oil production and THEY are the problem. You live in a fantasy world.

You're forgetting all those people SELLING oil futures into the market and taking the opposite side of the trade. Its a ZERO SUM GAME. When the contract expires, somebody has to take delivery of that oil meaning the trades have to sell out of their positions. If there is no physical demand at the end of the trade the price can't go up. If everybody is taking the same side of the trade, the price will and the traders get ****ed. It always has, it always will.

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

Democrats are the majority in the senate and were the majority in the house, are leading the executive branch and so I'd say that the majority of the problems we have are because of them. ;)

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

Sure, and having an oil company CEO as his predecessor, coupled with a "Drill, baby, drill" party majority in both houses didn't have anything to do with our invasion of Iraq, oil company record profits for most of Dubya's 8 years in office, and our hundreds of billions of dollars annual war spending orgy that make up the majority of our problems.

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

i suspect this thread will end soon, but it must be noted that pork(special interest/lobbying), entitlements(welfare/medicare/medicaid/illegal aliens), and waste could be put under one category...reckless leadership of the domestic variety. THAT is the lion share of our problems.

and it makes war spending look like gum ball money!

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

Really?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Militar...deral_spending

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

my reference was to recent wars...which i believe what was the previous premise of "war(s) for oil."

at any given time, "military" spending in and of itself is a good chunk of change irrespective and not including the added stress of "going to war." i would assume military spending would include the pentagon and any foreign aid when armed forces are needed to maintain integrity of said aid...among other things like maintain/upgrading subs, jets, carriers etc which have recently NOT been used in war!

i often wonder what the price of oil and how stable subsequent world economies would be if the US did not spend resources(like military) to protect oil...be it ours(a war for oil) or our allies.

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

back to fraud...

i dont believe american oil companies are "ripping us off", but i have questioned gouging of several pennies per gallon by certain station owners.

but, who's ripping us off more than big oil?...
https://www.allamericanblogger.com/15...ed-per-gallon/
https://arthenor.blogspot.com/2005/11...nment-gas.html
https://archive.newsmax.com/archives/...26/90121.shtml

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

Oil company tax breaks ?aren?t smart? says Obama
https://www.digitaljournal.com/article/306206

In his weekly address on Saturday, President Obama said he wants tax breaks for the oil and gas industry - $4 billion annually - to end, claiming they ?aren?t smart? and will ask Congress for help in the matter.

?These tax giveaways aren?t right,? the president said in his weekly address on Saturday. ?They aren?t smart. And we need to end them.?

The president?s announcement comes after oil and gas companies have begun releasing their first quarter results. Exxon Mobile last week reported a staggering $10.7 billion in profits during the first quarter, up from $6.3 billion (69 percent) over the same period a year earlier.

Conoco Phillips reported its first quarter earnings were up 43 percent to $3 billion. Last year?s earnings during the same period were $2.1 billion.

As he did during his election campaign of 2008, on Saturday Obama called for investing in clean energy for the future. ?An investment in clean energy today is an investment in a better tomorrow. And I think that's an investment worth making,? he said in his radio and Internet address.

Adding to his assessment of America?s current financial debate, the president stated: ?Our economy is growing again.? Yet much of that growth is apparently happening where most working class Americans could care less: in the pockets of big oil.

Equilar, an executive compensation data firm, notes that Rex Tillerson, CEO of Exxon Mobil, received a 2010 compensation package of $21.5 million, closely followed by ConocoPhillips CEO James Mulva, at $17.9 million. John Watson, CEO of Chevron, rounded out the top three oil executives with a 2010 compensation of $14 million.

Obama?s announcement of ending oil and gas subsidies will likely fall on deaf ears within the industry, as Exxon Mobile?s Ken Cohen, vice president of public and government affairs, in a statement to reporters last week said: ?We understand that it's simply too irresistible for many politicians in times of high oil prices and high earnings -- they feel they have to demonize our industry,? according to KFOX-TV.

According to a survey* by the US Energy Information Administration, the average cost to produce a barrel of oil (including exploration, development, extraction and taxes) is around $30 per barrel, while the current price market price of oil is over $110 per barrel, Huffington Post reports.

*Survey (pdf): https://big.assets.huffingtonpost.com/06_production.pdf

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

Oklahoma Congressman James Lankford criticizes administration on energy,

Freshman Rep. James Lankford, R-Oklahoma City, is the second Oklahoman tapped in April to deliver weekly national GOP message.

https://newsok.com/lankford-obama-focus-talks-on-energy/article/3563643

? President Barack Obama and Rep. James Lankford focused their parties? weekly messages Saturday on whether higher gasoline prices should result in more taxes on oil and gas companies.

The president, who renewed his call this week to eliminate some tax deductions used by oil and gas companies, said in his weekly address that he has ?a problem with the unwarranted taxpayer subsidies we?ve been handing out to oil and gas companies ? to the tune of $4 billion a year. When oil companies are making huge profits and you?re struggling at the pump, and we?re scouring the federal budget for spending we can afford to do without, these tax giveaways aren?t right.?

Lankford, a freshman Republican from Oklahoma City, said in the GOP weekly address that gas prices have doubled since Obama took office.

?Americans are looking for leadership to tackle the rising gas prices, but President Barack Obama has only offered a tax increase on energy and the prospect of reduced supply,? Lankford said.

Lankford was the second Oklahoman to deliver the national Republican address in April. Sen. Tom Coburn, R-Muskogee, gave the GOP message on deficit reduction April 16.

Obama has been proposing higher taxes on oil and gas companies since shortly after taking office in 2009; though he has focused his comments this week on the major companies, some of the biggest deductions he wants to eliminate wouldn?t affect them since they?re only available to independent producers. His administration has justified the proposed changes by saying current tax incentives encourage ?overproduction? of fossil fuels.

He said Saturday he believes ?instead of subsidizing yesterday?s energy, we should invest in tomorrow?s ? and that?s what we?ve been doing. Already, we?ve seen how the investments we?re making in clean energy can lead to new jobs and new businesses.?

Lankford said ending certain tax breaks used by oil and gas producers would hurt consumers and threaten jobs.

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

my district has one of the best congressmen in the country. altho, not related, we do have larger issues to "investigate" than steroids in baseball, gas fraud, and corp taxation...https://www.youtube.com/congressmanpo.../0/FWgZfHLPNXI

check out the debt graph at current spending policy...if it doesn't cause someone concern, well, i'd have to call he/she a ostrich. R Posey stole that analogy from me ;)

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

Lawmakers Call for FTC Review of Oil Refiners
Yesterday

SYRACUSE, N.Y. -- With gas prices inching their way down cent by cent, Sen. Charles Schumer (D-N.Y.) and Sen. Claire McCaskill (D-Mo.) are calling for an investigation into U.S. oil refiners.

Schumer's request for the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) to look into the refiners comes in the wake of new reports that suggest refiners are cutting back on gasoline stockpiles in an effort to decrease supply and inflate the pump prices, according to a press release from Schumer's office.

Specifically, the release cites Energy Information Administration data that show refiners are operating at just more than 80 percent of their capacity. This equals a decrease of 900,000 barrels per day when compared to 2010 output levels. Schumer pointed to the fact that gas prices have barely fallen below $4 per gallon in Syracuse, N.Y., despite crude oil prices coming down in recent weeks.

"At a time when major refiners and oil companies are making record profits and New York families continue to struggle with gasoline at record prices, the idea that refiners may be manipulating the market to keep prices artificially high is offensive," Schumer said speaking at a Syracuse Sunoco gas station this morning. "When the price of oil goes up, gas shoots up like a rocket -- but when it goes down, the price of gas falls like a feather. That's just not right. As the price of crude oil and the use of gasoline decline, there are clear signs that refiners may be stockpiling oil, which keeps prices high. I urge the FTC to immediately investigate and ensure that New Yorkers are not being victimized by this type of manipulation."

In a letter co-signed by Sens. Schumer, McCaskill, Harry Reid (D-Nev.), Dick Durbin (D-Ill.) and Patty Murray (D-Wash.), the legislators formally asked the FTC to investigate the issue and pointed out it is currently within the FTC's authority to review the allegations for any potential wrongdoing.

"It is incumbent upon the commission to ensure that the American people are protected from this type of manipulation. Accordingly, we request that the commission open a full investigation into these allegations of wrongdoing and to determine the impact this behavior, if confirmed, has on regional and national gasoline prices," the letter stated.

According to AAA's Fuel Gauge Report, the average price for a gallon of regular gas was $3.843 today, down from $3.852 yesterday and $3.955 a week ago.

https://www.csnews.com/top-story-lawmakers_call_for_ftc_review_of_oil_refiners-58758.html

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

record profit at what profit percentage?

record profit for what volume of sales?

i suspect the "review" will be forgotten when prices fall enough that it is recognized at an acceptable inflationary rate.

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

They're just pretty much pissed at the price they have to pay for fuel, regardless of whether or not there is profit involved, no matter what the percentage is.. People willing to pay 50% markup for an iPod but to pay .05-1% markup for gasoline is abhorrent.. ridiculous.. Also the same people that call for price controls which if they knew better, would know that price controls would lead to rationing (gas lines) like we had in the 70s.

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

fraud or not, the price of gas is affecting the economy...https://www.usatoday.com/money/indust...s-summer_n.htm

no question consumer choice of vehicle is a concern, but what about the political blame game? i don't hear it anymore. hmmmmm...

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

Well, have there been more secret energy meetings with the oil companies hmmmmmm?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...111501842.html

Does anyone in the current admin have an oil tanker named after them... like Chevron's "The Condoleeza Rice"?

Is our current VP an ex-oil company chairman and CEO like Cheney/Halliburton?

Do any of the president's relatives have leadership positions in the military/industrial/oil complex?

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

https://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,72569,00.html

"The Cheney energy plan issued in the spring of 2001 called for expanded oil and gas drilling on public land and eased regulatory barriers to new nuclear power plants. The plan's recommendations included steps to increase conservation and encourage the use of alternative fuels as well as to protect the environment."

i can see why the left and enviro nuts wanted the info.

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

You seemed to need a refresher as to why "you don't hear the political blame game anymore hmmmm". So there it is. But you knew that already. So why the charade?

I would certainly think that people other than the "left and enviro nuts" would want to know what the nation's energy policy is... right? Is there any reason for such a thing to be secret from the citizens? Is there any way that such a thing could be kept secret? The answer is no. Unless... you like being in the dark. The only reason it was secret was so that they could ram regulations and laws favorable to themselves through without giving anyone a heads-up. Nice huh.

LOL- "steps to promote conservation"- you mean like tax breaks for giant guzzlers? :confused:

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

with ya clencher. we can't "do" politics any more, but you can't compare relatively low profit percentage(even if it yields billlions $$$) and POSSIBLE coverup to the trillions of tax payer dollars that were both withheld (info) AND against the will of the people! that would be the current administration with the help of congress. i think i'd like to leave them out of it!

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

I'm not comparing squat and I'm not delving into politics any more than this here on GS. Just pointing out why w got heat for gas prices and obama not as much.

Re: Gas Price Fraud?
 

fair enough...i believe consumers have more to do with it (high fuel prices) than anything. but, i will say, in my travels, i've seen some shady(fluctuating) pricing by station owners.