Where can I get non-Ethanol gas
 

I was wondering where I could get non-ethanol mixed gasoline in Massachusetts? Every station I have been to in my hometown has the 10% mixture sticker on the pump...

Probably nowhere. It's replaced MTBE.

you dont have just regular? we usally have a pick form three types

The pumps have a sticker on the bottom part that states the 10% Ethanol mix. It doesn't seem to be for a particular grade so I believe it is for all grades.

You will have to do some research in your state, ethanol use varies by state.
For instance here in MN all gas is E-10 except for a few stations that carry 91 octane gas with no eth. this gas is only for classic cars and motorcycle/ boats ect. That doesn't stop me from using it though.:D Some states have a choice, some have ethanol just in the 87 octane gas.

I know Michigan gas is E10, even though some time ago our governor Granny mandated that all the stickers be removed from the pumps. I guess that's to cover the stations that didn't put the stickers on the pumps. E10 is the defacto standard. No getting away from it anymore, at least in the States.

Why avoid it?

1. because, from reading in this forum I am seeing a reduction in MPG
2. I want to see how high I can get my MPG in my Corolla

You don't have a choice in that part of the country. Sorry.

That's what I figured.

One other topic that has me confused is fuel additives?

Is there something that works both with MPG and is actually worth it $$$ wise?
I've seen some posts in this forum and some say that it's a big scam and others swear by it.
Can someone eluminate me?

Although you can't test it because you can't get regular fuel. Your Toyota might be doing fine on E10. Toyota did a study and found that it did not have much effect on the small displacement motors. I looked and could not find it but here's another one that tested a Camry with no decrease if FE.

I wouldn't worry too much about E10, in such small quantities I don't think it effects the car much at all...

I never noticed any difference switching on my car. *shrug*

Only a 10% mix will me negligible at best with your mileage. If you were running E85, it would only make a few MPG difference (maybe five if that). It burns cleaner and is well worth the loss of .5 mpg.

Kinda of a double edge sword although the GHG are reduce the evaporation on E10 is increased and NOX is increased over 5%. Pick your posion:)

Nox goes up that much? Really now...how odd. You have any stats on propane?

LPG is the hot ticket. I wish it was not so expensive in TX to convert. PM10 fraction of diesel, NOx half of Petro, and VOC 60% less then Petro. Just for you since your google isn't working:p

My lazy is working though! I am really bad at looking things up...

I wonder about running partial propane...would the ECU just compensate and use less fuel? Even 20% on propane would rock...

I think on LPG it about half that. I think that number is for CNG.


Probably should start another thread on this not to get it to OT. But what did they teach you at school as far as GHG and the rest of the emissions story. Should we be putting our primary efforts into reduction of GHG or NOx, PM10 and VOC's. I know, it's not that simple.:)

Start another thread and I'll say what I know, :p

I will get on this LPG business as some point, I swear!

With a diesel engine that was converted to somehow manually feed in propane you would just let off the accelerator pedal, eh? No ECU adjustment of anything... it is definitely interesting.

I'm thinking if you just hook up something based on vacuum but try to limit it to 20-30 percent then it would just let you know how much to let off based on the throttle needed to keep going...*shrug*

I really don't think so. For starters, ethanol has 30% less BTU's per gallon than gasoline (less energy). Meanwhile, since ethanol has an octane of 110, it gives an incentive for the other 90% of gas to be a lower octane to meet the 87 standard.

Ethanol is a scam. Why else would ethanol be mandatory in New York? This is the same state that *mandates* putting chemicals (additives) in cigarettes. I'm not kidding, come buy a pack and look at the huge black bar next to the barcode. That's the sign of compliance, and the cigs taste like crap (fortunately, natural cigs are exempt).

New York is the same state that used MBTE until recently, and is now struggling with the environmental impact.

Demand real gas.

I'm confused. So NY switches to E10 because of the MBTE environmental impact so it's a scam?

Yeah, but ethanol is not an octane booster. Octane boosters such as methanol (listed as an ingredient on my last purchase) and acetone (octane 150) are added OUNCES per tank. Ethanol is added GALLONS per tank. So think again.

zpiloto: >I'm confused. So NY switches to E10 because of the MBTE environmental impact so it's a scam?

Point is, New York will screw with any product as long as it involves screwing with it. Mandating cigarette additives is a fiasco. MBTE was a fiasco. So you think they got it right this time?

It's better than MTBE, being government mandated doesn't make it a scam, ;)

I don't have any links for this(now MY lazy is kicking in:p ) but I have seen where ethanol lowered two types of polution but, it actually raised a couple of others. The way ethanol is being pushed here-made from corn-is going to backfire in a big way by raising food costs. I read recently that Mexico is already experiencing shortages of corn for flour, tortillas, etc. Until ethanol can be made from things like corn stalks and other cellulose sources it won't work.

I don't think the enzyme technology is that far in the future. They'll be making ethanol from grass about the time big oil is looking for new poison to sell.

Ethanol is an octane booster. Full stop.

In some places ethanol is added to 87 octane RUL to make 89 octane midgrade.

Your position was summarized when you said, "Who cares about BTUs?"

E10 has ~3.5% less energy than gasoline. Is 3.5% important to hypermilers?

I would call it "watered-down."

Luckily I have one of those stations that sells 92 octane non-oxygenated and no ethanol in it. It makes for some very nice MPG numbers!

Hmm, unless they choose to not post it, the local BP's and Sheetz's don't have E-10.

Just because it has 3.5% less BTU's does not mean that you will get 3.5% less FE. Even if it did cause a decrease in FE some hypermilers are not in it for strictly FE gains. There are quite a few here that put emissions at the fore front.:)

Not a math wizard but that would be something like 3.5% of 10% wouldn't it?
Since Ethanol has 3.5% less burn effeciency and E10 gas has an average of 10% ethanol...
So, I get around 54MPG on my Corolla right now.
3.5 * .10 = .35
100 - .35 = 99.65
54 * .9965 = 53.81MPG

If the numbers are right I can live with them...

Some small displacement engines actually get better FE with ethanol.:thumbup: YMMV

ill take the hit for the emissions and suporting farmers around here