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-   -   Why are the hybrid motors not in all cars? (http://www.fuelly.com/forums/f35/why-are-the-hybrid-motors-not-in-all-cars-5427.html)

Possum on brick 07-15-2007 09:26 PM

Why are the hybrid motors not in all cars?
 
The hybrid motor what I read about it is that it pulles in a gas mixure too lean to burn it then injects a vary small rich mixture at the plug the combination still leaner than what a normal engine can run . The hybrid cars have a ultra lean burning engine. I wish someone would ask the President why these engines are not in all cars and trucks! They would get better hiway miles than a hybrid can because they would be lighter in weight and cheeper to buy without the electric parts. I am screaming why are not these motors not in the new cars by now!!

Jim Dunlop 07-16-2007 03:21 AM

Because we are not a socialist nation (yet).

Get together some investors, start a car company using this engine, and market it to people like us. Make tons of money AND help people at the same time!

skewbe 07-16-2007 03:59 AM

Opossum, I believe you are describing a "stratified charge" engine, still a challenge to implement IIRC:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stratified_charge_engine

Bill in Houston 07-16-2007 04:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Possum on brick (Post 63837)
The hybrid motor what I read about it is that it pulles in a gas mixure too lean to burn it then injects a vary small rich mixture at the plug the combination still leaner than what a normal engine can run .

Sounds more expensive to build than an ordinary engine. That's probably why.

Sludgy 07-16-2007 06:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skewbe (Post 63857)
Opossum, I believe you are describing a "stratified charge" engine, still a challenge to implement IIRC:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stratified_charge_engine

I'm not sure which "hybrid" engine he's talking about, but the stratified charge engine has been made obsolete. Direct injection gasoine engines achieve better fuel economy and leaner burning. Both Audi and GM are working on them. Orbital Engine is working on making a combination spark plug/direct fuel injector that could bring DFI to the masses.

GasSavers_bobski 07-16-2007 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sludgy (Post 63877)
Direct injection gasoine engines achieve better fuel economy and leaner burning. Both Audi and GM are working on them.

Honda's been selling them since early 2004 at least. link

brucepick 07-16-2007 11:09 AM

Yikes.

Hybrid basically = a combination of features from two different types. As in a hybrid plant.

Hybrid cars combine a gasoline engine plus battery motor + electric power generation driven by the spinning drivetrain. This gives some big efficiency benefits you can't get using only gasoline.

You can also make a hybrid with diesel + electric or natural gas + electric or even hydrogen + electric. Same concept.

The concept is to engage a large generator when braking is wanted. The generator places a huge drag on the rolling system's momentum which slows it down, capturing electrical energy in the process. Which is stored in large battery bank. The generator is also used to charge the battery at other times, depending on battery charge level and the amount of power demand from the driver.

The battery bank + electric motor is used primarily in two ways. 1) When starting the car from a stop. 2) When more power is needed than the little gasoline engine can provide. This last one lets them make the hybrid with smaller engine than what would normally be used. So even when it's running on gasoline only, it's getting better mpg because the engine size is smaller. Yes it really works that way. As in, two Cadillac's, one with V8 and one with V6. The V6 will get better mpg even though the vehicles are nearly identical.

The hybrid cars we have now also use some of our best FE technology that's not usually used in other vehicles. Such as overall better aero design, underbody aero treatment (though that is becoming more common), low rolling resistance tires, and Atkinson cycle engine design (a slight modification to the intake/compression/power/exhaust strokes, try look it up in Wikipedia). And more. Whatever they can think of that they think will be cost-effective for that car.

Most/all of these things aren't related to hybrid technology at all. If you put them on a regular car or even on a motorcycle you'd get better fuel efficiency from that vehicle.

Dig?

cfg83 07-16-2007 11:11 AM

Possum on brick -

Quote:

Originally Posted by Possum on brick (Post 63837)
The hybrid motor what I read about it is that it pulles in a gas mixure too lean to burn it then injects a vary small rich mixture at the plug the combination still leaner than what a normal engine can run . The hybrid cars have a ultra lean burning engine. I wish someone would ask the President why these engines are not in all cars and trucks! They would get better hiway miles than a hybrid can because they would be lighter in weight and cheeper to buy without the electric parts. I am screaming why are not these motors not in the new cars by now!!

Can you tell us which motor you are talking about? Where did you read this?

CarloSW2

cfg83 07-16-2007 11:36 AM

bobski -

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobski (Post 63889)
Honda's been selling them since early 2004 at least. link

Thanks for the link, I love these details :

Quote:

Major features of the Absolute (2.0L)

Driving performance

Engine: Newly developed direct in-cylinder injection 2.0L DOHC i-VTEC I gasoline engine
? The newly developed 2-liter DOHC i-VTEC I engine incorporates advanced Honda technologies and intelligent control systems, for class-leading fuel economy as well as clean emissions and high output --- two areas which are problematic for direct injection engines.
? The newly developed 2-liter DOHC i-VTEC I integrates the i-VTEC system, which combines VTEC (Variable Valve Timing and Lift Electronic Control) and VTC (Variable Timing Control), with a newly developed center injection system, for an air-fuel ratio*1 of 65:1, an unprecedented level of ultra-lean combustion. Stable combustion is achieved with considerably less fuel than with conventional direct injection engines, for which an air-fuel ratio of 40:1 was the limit. The new engine makes for sporty driving and a high fuel efficiency of 15.0 km/L*2.
? Combustion control through the use of high-precision EGR valves and a newly developed high-performance catalyst enable the i-VTEC I, while a lean-burn direct engine, to qualify as an Ultra Low Emissions Vehicle.
*1 EGR included
*2 Fuel economy in 10-15 mode (Japanese Ministry of Land, Infrastructure and Transport calculations)

15.0 km/L = 35 MPG.

I went and looked for the car's curb weight :

Honda Stream 1.8 X (A)
http://motorzone.com.sg/home/index.p...d=61&Itemid=60
Quote:

Dimension (LxWxH) : 4570mm x 1695mm x 1545mm
Wheelbase : 2740mm
Min. Ground Clearance : 150mm
Tread Front (mm) :
Tread Rear (mm) :
Curb Weight (kg) : 1350

1350 kg = 2976 lbs.

Hrmmmm. I was actually hoping for more curb weight so that the MPG would look even better. But I guess for a minivan this is pretty good.

CarloSW2

jcp123 07-16-2007 07:33 PM

I thought Honda had lean burn engines similar to this idea back in the 70's. If it gets good torque and decent power, I'm all for it.


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