2008 smart fortwo test drive
 

I was in Seattle on August 2th to get a test drive of the new to the USA (and Canada for that matter) 2008 smart fortwo.

Brief recapitulation:

The smart is a two seater micro-car that is designed by Mercedes-Benz, conceived by Nicolas Hayek of swatch fame and Daimler-Benz in the mid-1990s. The goal was to build a city car that was ecologicaly responsible (compared to other cars) and would make travel and parking in urban areas simpler. The first smart cars came off the assembly line in Hambach, Lorraine, France in late 1997, and the first ones were sold in 1998. 770,256 of the first generation models were sold worldwide between 1998 and right about now.

The smart is currently sold in 36 countries worldwide, and the USA is set to become the 37th in January 2008. Canada got the car in diesel form between October 2004 and now (there are under 90 unsold new smarts remaining in Canada, where nearly 10,200 have been sold). To add to the confusion, there is a company in California, G&K automotive, which does a grey-market conversion of the European gasoline-powered original smart, and some 800 or so of these have been sold in the USA for prices as high as $30K (ridiculous IMO).

Roger Penske's Penske Auto Group (PAG) is the official importer for the USA and the advent of "official" smart cars should spell the end of the grey market conversions.

PAG has had a smart car reservation/deposit program in place since earlier this year, and to date they have over 30,000 pre-orders. Officially, they expected to sell about 20,000 per year in the US, which would still make the USA a major smart market.

PAG has been taking a "smart car caravan" consisting of 71 horsepower naturally aspirated gasoline-powered 2007 model European market smart cars on a USA-wide tour since early summer, and this tour is mainly for the benefit of the 30,000 depositors, to give them a chance to try out the car and decide whether to make a firm order. It is also typical of smart's guerrilla marketing. They almost never use conventional means to advertise.

Anyway, as a Canadian owner of a diesel smart car since the first week of 2005, I was curious about the new car. We will get it in Canada too, but we're not getting any early test drive opportunities, so I, my youngest daughter and two smart-owning friends drove down to Seattle to check out the new cars first-hand....hoping we would get a test drive despite not being potential PAG customers.

The Seattle area smart dealer will be immediately to the East side of Acura of Seattle at Southcenter Mall in Tukwila, close to I-5, I-405 and Sea-Tac.

We rolled up there in our older model smarts and parked near where the tests were happening....the eyes of the smart USA people were on us as we arrived.

The first thing we did is go up to the registration desk, where we were asked if we'd like to test the cars. You bet! They got us to sign a waiver and lay down our BC driver's licenses, ee got our test drive wristbands and that was it.

First impressions: smart have got the exterior design very right! The styling of the new car is very successful in my opinion....true to the spirit of the original but in a few ways, better. Ergonimically too, it is improved. One of the ways it is better is in the well-known details: more room in the trunk, more passenger space (I could move the seat back further than in my car and the dead pedal was perfectly placed for me, unlike in my own car), easier access to the front for washer fluid, brake fluid reservoir, coolant overflow bottle and headlight bulbs.

The interior is nice too. Some current smart owners have decried what they call a lack of originality in the new fortwo's interor design details, but I am not in the school of thought that says there is no funkiness in the car's interior now. It is still nice, modern, ergonomically sound and has some of the cheap plastics found in the older model, so I felt right at home.

I drove two cars there, a black on black cabriolet which had neither paddle shiffters on the steering wheel nor a tachometer, and then a coupé that had both.

The cabrio drive was nice, and although the top was up with A/C blowing hard when I got in (these cars seemed to have very effective A/C while at idle), I put the soft roof all the way down while driving, and that sure is a nice feature. The glass rear window is a major improvement over the plastic item on my car too.

The 71 HP engine was surprising on a couple of counts: it seemed anemic off the line (moreso than the diesel) and it vibrated a bit more than my diesel cdi at idle, though it was inaudible. That said, it accelerated more quickly than the diesel, in a smooth and non-cammy way (no VTEC-style neck snaping at 6K RPM in this car). This is typical of European cars, in my experience...

I would think that smart should consider re-calibrating the tip-in point for the accelerator pedal to suit US tastes, because most US cars rocket off the line with a very small depression to the accelerator pedal. With the 451, you had to mash it to make the car get up and go. Once accelerating, it subjectively felt no faster than the 450 cdi in the first two gears, but that could be because the new model is quieter inside, and is missing a gear in the lower range (it has a 5 speed sequential manual as oposed to the old car's 6 speed).

Also, it doesn't do the rocking horse moton during gearshifts as much when accelerating hard, which although annoying in the older version, at least gives a sense of occasion to bursts of (moderate) acceleration! No doubt the new model with 71 HP is a lot faster than the old diesel, but subjectively it didn't seem to be. The official times are 0-62.1 MPH in 13.3 seconds for the new one, versus 19.8 seconds for the diesel.

The torque impression, compared to the old diesel, is weak (and the new car does have less torque than the cdi, despite weighing 40 kg more). Still it pulled quite well and I doubt that anyone would compain that it is so slow as to be dangerous. Top speed is limited to 145 km/h (92 MPH).

In my opinion, this is a car range crying out for the optional Brabus turbocharged engine, which kicks out some serious torque and has 98 HP, getting the 0-62.1 MPH time under 10 seconds. This model s being introduced in Europe as I write this, and a 112 HP version will be unveiled at the Frankfurt Auto Show next week. Offering a 71 HP version for fuel economy buffs or Joe/Jane Average, and a hotshoe version for sportier drivers would be a great idea. There is also an 84 HP turbocharged version in Europe.

Note that these acceleration times are not the type that the automobile magazines would wring out of cars with regular manual transmissions (power-shifting for example is not possible as the gears are selected by servo motors), so they will be representative of real-world driving,not horrific car abuse on the test track, with smoking clutch linings.

I had a better opportunity to assess the engine in the second car, the one equipped with a tachomter and clock pod on top of the dash, as well as the delightful steering wheel-mounted shifter paddles. Curiously, this car's engine seemed to be rougher than that of the cabrio. It actually buzzed a bit at a certain rpm (might have been a rattle in the engine compartment). The engine delivers its power smoothly but in an almost un-noticeable manner, meaning there is no shove in the back when you get up to 4000 or more rpm. So it seems that - as with the older model - the engine noise and vibration is a bit more obvious in the coupé, whereas the cabriolet has less engine noise but more wind noise. Nevertheless, the engine is smooth and unobtrusive in accelerating, but also unimpressive. The noise is high when the engine is over 4000 rpm, and it soundls like a Geo Metro, which is not a bad thing.

The transmission is supposed to be 50% faster than ours when changing gear, but I could not detect much of a difference. Perhaps it is a little quicker, but the shift pauses are still there and noticeable. On the other hand, the shifts ar smoother and more similar to how a true automatic would operate.

The exterior temperature indicator in the cabrio was malfunctioning, as it indicated 20 degrees C when it was at least 30 degrees out. I pointed this out to the smart USA employee riding shotgun with me.

On the one (square) block test drive we had, there was no opportunity to test the roadholding. The ride was certainly better than on the present model. It feels more like a "real car" than the older model. I would say that, like my own carl, this car would massively benefit from wider rubber, preferably 175/55-15 on the front and 195/50-15 on the rear, tightening up the steering response and stability at speed. The new pulse version wheels which wear these wider tires - not to be offered in the USA or Canada by the dealers - look nice, from the photos they had on dislay. these will be available on the aftermarket (genuine smart wider wheels like I have, as well as other brands).

Incidentally, the test cars were all on Continental Eco Contact 3 low-rolling resistance tires, 155/40-15 front and 175/55-15 rear, which I presume will become available in sizes suitable for the older model too (namely 145/65-15 front).

The fuel flap said that the car needs 95 RON fuel, which would be 90 US Octane. I forgot to ask if they have a knock sensor.... so it remains to be seen if the USA/CDN version of this car will need more than 87 RON+MON/2....it will be a marketig problem for sure if the car requires premium only.

We spent some time examining the possibilities for retrofitting aftermarket cruise control to these cars. The manufacturer does not envision offering cruise control on this model, unlike the previous one (my car for example has factory cruise control, a grey-market install, because it was not offered "officially" in Canada). Again, I think CC is a must. Although it is a city car, many people would be tempted to buy it as a commuter car, and cruise control would be a welcome item for people like that.

One detail I didn't like was the inclusion of upholstery on the back of the seats. The older model seats have a hammered enamel finish, highlighting the seat's thick deformable metal safety cell structure, which is still there in the new seats, but is not obvious. They look like 1975 Pinto seats from behind, but they are supremely comfortable! There would appear to be enough room behind the driver's seat for a full-sized (front) spare tire. The car comes with a tire re-inflation kit.

Much has been written about the supposedly poor fuel economy potential of this smart. This UNINFORMED SPECULATION is remarkable. I read about "40 US MPG" etc as the EPA highway rating, when the car hasn't even been certified yet. I can say that in the European test cycle, this car gets 50 US MPG in the combined cycle (on 95 RON fuel), so I would expect the FE potential to be there for those who want to maximize efficiency. As you all know, EPA ratings are tougher than before, and perhaps it will be in the low 40s combined. We will see.

Safety: the new model has been designed to achieve 4 out of 5 stars in the EuroNCAP tests, so it'll be as good as other small cars.

Prices start at under $11 K US for a base model, which comes with ESP, ABS, Brake Assist (all the Mercedes active safety stuff), 4 airbags, power windows remote central locking, leather steering wheel and shifter, driver-selectible automatic mode, transparent polycarbonate roof. A fully loaded convertible will cost just under $17 Grand.

I will try to upload some photos when I get my busted (for a second time) Canon MP600 printer back.

I gave the main smart employee there a Canadian Eco smart sticker after we were done and he gave me a smart "open your mind" T-shirt in exchange (discreetly because he didn't have very many). which was a nice gesture. He was keen to drive one of our cdis but, we both had to leave before the show was over at 7:30 PM, my friends to get back to Abbotsford and Kelowna and us to catch the last ferry from Tsawassen to Nanaimo BC at 10:45 PM.

Would I buy one? Sure, if I didn't already have a diesel convertible! But my car is lots of fun and gets staggeringly good fuel economy with no effort, so I'd be nuts to change it. If I was in the USA, I would definitely get one of these.

Mike T -

Great review! I think I saw the "smart car caravan" earlier this year on the 710 freeway in LA. It was zooming in the fast lane, probably doing a normal 65-70 MPH.

CarloSW2

:thumbup: Really good review!

A very good read. I wonder why they made the 2008 version a 5speed and not a 6? I like the look of the new smart too (it's a bit sleeker and more car like).

The six speed was really a compromise, a three speed gearbox with two final drive ratios. The excessive number of gears is useful for the diesel engine with its narrow torque peak band (1800-2800 RPM) but it was overkill on the gasoline cars, which like to be revved. The spacing is set up so that when shifting at the top end of that torque range, the next gear up comes in around 2100 RPM, which made for good linear progress. The 3-4 shift is slower than the others because not only does it go from gear 3 back to 1, the final drive is also changed. The new box doesn't have that issue.

So on the new model, the 5 speed is a normal gearbox with one final drive ratio.....5 speeds is fine, though I have read reviews of the new cdi diesel from Germany that say there are now gaps in the torque band. This will only be noticed by North Americans if we are ever offered the new diesel though. Its average fuel consumption rating in Europe is 71.2 US MPG.

And they're supposedly bringing a hybrid version of the cdi out next year (for Europe); count on 80 MPG US average.

Interesting review Mike.

I was slightly off on the price, it's $11,590, not "under $11K" as I wrote above.

The pricing can be seen here: https://www.smartusa.com/ under the "product" tab.

FE estimates have still not been released.

Those cars are so sweet! Almost anyone i know around here are really afraid of how safe they are they just dont get it i guess.

Mike T -

If I got a Smart, it would be Yellow/Black with tan interior :

Attachment 906

But, I want the paddle shifter that comes with the "Passion" model and the manual window that comes with the "Pure" model. If I started with the "Pure" model, would I be able to retrofit the paddle shifter?

CarloSW2

Yes, it can be dealer-fitted. It is expensive though, about $1000 CDN at our dealers (ouch!!). Probably it would come in around $700 in the US.

My car has paddles and they are FABULOUS!

DARN YOU!! You just cost me about $13k +/- USD. The wife has been waiting patiently for one of these for many years now and I promised her one when the time comes (US Spec not grey market). Looks like the time has come - I haven't been actively waiting for one so I haven't kept track of them much and this thread renewed her interest.

I just reserved a Pure. I was going to spend the extra $400 for met. blue w/ silver accents because she hates yellow (which is what I want) but the $400 extra killed that. Looks like we'll have a bumblebee :D We are going cheap cheap cheap. Need no frills except A/C.


Did you get interior pics yet? :rolleyes: The smartusa site lacks them.

Sweet! Welcome to the club! Check out www.clubsmartcar.ca!

I just came back from driving the new smart fortwo here in Portland, OR. Mikes review is quite accurate, so I don't really have much to add. I was impressed with the car, which was surprising because I've been following it for so long I figured it would disappoint me. A very solid feel to the drive, though I didn't take it on the highway. The polycarbonate roof version is great, a very open feel. The engine bay is incredibly tight, which I guess I should have expected for the size of it. Future mechanics will have to be very flexible and small.

The guy I drove with said they (the smart tour) have been getting high 40's in the city and low 50's on the highway. Certainly not hypermiling either; he said he personally was a lead foot and drove 85-90mph and got 43mpg between Seattle and Portland.

I'm still disappointed in the lack of CDI diesel, especially with the new more powerful and efficient version they have now in Europe. As I've said before, if the CDI was coming here my name would be on the reservation list, ready to run Biodiesel. Right now, looking at the current car with mostly a FE eye, I probably wouldn't be making an improvement over my VX. This makes considering such a purchase all the more difficult. I would really like to support small cars here in the USA. If there is not enough interest in cars like the fortwo then we'll just keep on getting cars with pathetic FE numbers, and the US "fleet" will remain inefficient.

Consider this: a version of the 70/71 HP gasoline engine with stop/start system, whch improves the FE in the ECE "combined" cycle by nearly 10%, should be introduced for North America in 2008 sometime. It is out in Europe starting in a week or two.

I hear what you're saying about this car's FE not being better than the VX, but also the concern that if the car does not sell well in the USA, others will not be offered either, therefore: more SUVs with 6.3 L V-8s will be made for the masses.

I have read some reviews of the new cdi diesel from Europe and the news is mixed. Sure, the economy potential is better than with the gasoline version, but the new 5 speed gearbox leaves gaps in the engine's optimal torque spacings when shifting between a couple of gears....the engine reportedly falls off the boil and it takes a while to spool it up again. That is an issue we don't have with our older version, because it has a 6 speed with geometric spacing. Every upward gearshift - if done at even 2500 RPM, lands the older model right into the low end of the peak torque range (1800 RPM). Shifting at 2800 lands it in the higher gear at 2300 RPM, right in the middle of the peak torque band (which is 1800-2800 RPM). With the new one, you either fall off the peak curve or have to rev it higher in the lower gears before shifting. That doesn't sound like lots of fun.

Also, checking spritmonitor.de, the eight 33 kW diesels (new version, as opposed to the 30 kW version I have) are averaging a poor 4.96 L/100 km (47 US MPG) so far (admittedly not well run in yet) versus a better 4.13 L/100 km (57 US MPG) for the older model (361 cars). I wonder if the number for the new model will approach the old one, with the advent of more members there reporting FE, and break in. I know in my car's case, the FE went from 4.3 average after 2500 km, to 3.88 now, a relatively small improvement. I guess I am concerned that the new cdi may not be as efficient as the older one, notwithstanding the "official FE numbers" from the ECE. Bear in mind that the typical member of spritmonitor drives in Germany and is not trying to hypermile.

You could always get a cabriolet, so it is a multi-purpose car: decent FE and a fun cruiser for sunny days...? I don't know. That's sort of how I rationalized buying ours. In reality it was a surrealistic decision, considering that we have three kids and the family car was super high mileage at 200,000+ miles. But now we're buying a Mercedes B 200 so I guess that part has been taken of, nearly three years later. Good luck with your decision.

Man, Smart is really dragging it's feet on getting the US release rolled out. Feel like I've been waiting to buy for years...

lol has mpre hp than my chevette (63 horses woo!!!) still wouldnt buy one tho. i wanna know about reliability. i plan to keep cars till they rust in half or blow up. those shifting servos are gonna wear out sooner or later all the while my mechanical slushbox is goin just fine. that and i wanan be able to accualy do maintince stuff to the engine so i dont get screwed at an auto shop....so can you accualy get to everyhting? like wires, plugs, t-stat, any othe rlittle filters/valves?

DIY is pretty easy on most stuff.

The 2005 smart fortwo was the least likely car to break down in a German survey in 2006, beating all Toyotas and everything else. So the pedigree is good for reliability.

About the servos etc, examining all the European smart forums, I have NEVER seen failed servos mentioned, and the car has been out for nine+ years.

I had an opportunity to drive a new style smart car with the 84 HP turbo engine on September 19th.

Of course my comments on the test drive in Seattle would generally apply to this one, with the exception of the power and sound of the engine, which is absolutely superb in the turbo!

The acceleration is exhilirating after driving a car with less than half the power for 3 years. Offically 0-100 drops in 10.9 seconds, but it feels a lot faster than that. The shift program in softouch was very well suited to hard driving, and the shifts were very smooth.

There is more low-down torque apparent than with the older cdi smart that I drive, and the power rises sharply towards the top end of the rev range, unlike the cdis, which have flat power between 3000 and 4500 rpm. This peaky characteristic lets the engine stretch into a loud bark as you get higher into the ever-rising power band, then it hits the limiter and softouch switches it into the next gear (this car did not have a tach!!).

I would STRONGLY encourage smart to bring this car (and the Brabus) to Canada and the USA as an optional powertrain for 2009.

It was simply fabulous. Now I really want to drive a Brabus......and a Brabus 112....

Mike, do the paddle shifters offer any added functionality or are they simply there for convienience?

I want to get a Pure (if it ever actually gets released) with minimal options. However, if I can improve mileage with the paddle shifters then I'll want them.

Please advise,
Colby

if the FE was good, I'd be interested in this car. That it gets less than 70mpg and isn't really able for highway driving makes it unappealing. The real benefit seems to be being able to park in more city parking spaces, other than that, what does it offer a sub-compact doesn't? My car is much bigger and heavier, has more horsepower, has better 0-60 acceleration, is 15 years older, and despite all that gets better gas mileage! Sorry, just had to point this out.

I'm really sick of all the VX owner's elitism. All of you need to quit it already.

Can I go out and buy a new VX?

Be happy you have one. No need to come to this thread and gloat.

Sorry, just had to point this out.

There are lots of them in Ontario and I see them all the time on the freeways. My only issue with the Smart is where do you put a kid or two?

yeah, that too. I just read in an article about the '08 Smart saying it wasn't really driveable on the freeways. Too underpowered or something. Other than the slight inconvenience of being two doors, the VX has great utility. My bike goes in and out of the back with relative ease.

They are one of the best features of the car, far better than using the floor shifter in manual mode! Get them if you can!

Well try driving one first. Whoever said that it's not suitable for highway driving is dead wrong. It's actually more at home on the highway than it is in the city. I've driven mine on Interstate highways at 85 MPH and it's just fine, thank you very much. I know three people who've driven theirs clean across Canada and back, and enjoyed every minute thoroughly.

The fuel economy is going to be better than nearly any other new car, even with the 71 HP gas engine without stop/start (mhd) system, and in the hands of FE enthusiasts I have no doubt that it will perform very, very well. If someone like Basjoos gets hold of one, look out.

maybe I'll find the article that said they are unsuitable for highway and you can sound off to the writer.

Here is a cool video showing the smart car in a crash. Pretty impressive.

here's the article

I just got a copy of a road test from Germany that indicated - on an economy-minded test mind you - that the gas engine will do 68 US MPG. The overall average during the road test (including normal driving and performance testing) was 47 US MPG. So it seems that 70 MPG will not be out of the question.

I am not going to be wasting time emailing a motoring writer about the fact that he's wrong. I leave it to readers of this thread to decide. Who would you believe: someone whe test drove the car for a day or two, or someone who has driven his for three years? LOL

Crash testing: E 320 vs. fortwo
 

Besides the spectacular but rather meaningless test in your link, there were some serious tests done: https://www.thesmart.ca/index.cfm?id=...nguage=english.

The new one is safer too.

Going to the "special" reservation holder only invite tomorrow. EXCITED! Only problem is it'll come in sometime around 2009 where I stand on the reservation list and the rate they are confirming & making orders. :(

I got the wife talked into going for a Passion versus Pure. Also shes letting me option it out nicely. Big question, is the power steering electric or manual?

It's electric....very light at parking speeds but firm and with strong centering at highway speeds.

I think they'll probably order up a few more to get rid of the order backlog, if they can.

Enjoy the drive!

Just got back - 10 hour drive to get there and back!!. The one I drove didn't have the paddle shifter though it had the gauge package on the dash which I liked. (clock & tach)

No complaints - the girl driving with me "suggested" shifting at 3k rpm's which I complied with until I decided to "really" see how acceleration was. I don't think she was happy though I only did it for maybe 1/8th mile from a stop light just to see what it would do, shifted manually at 5k which still felt conservative. Plenty of pep.

She was able to tell me the PS was electric too. Though I wonder if I really need it (or if the wife needs it). I'll leave that option off when they finally send me my order form - it'll save me $850 as I don't need the other options included in the package.

I really thought they were going to pay more attention to the "cash in hand, ready to purchase, reservation holders" today and take in the "walk-ins" on Friday-Sunday since it was advertised for Fri-Sun. They took walk-ins today as well so trying to get answers to my questions wasn't easy due to the crowd. :( On top of that, I forgot to ask the big question about cruise-control too. Also, I couldn't remember what I had my elbow resting on when I drove it though my wife suggested it may have been the attractive SMART employee co-driver. I think she may have protested if I had done that - at least for another 5 minutes until she got to know me better. :D It felt natural in there even with the lack of an armrest which is a pet peeve of mine; car without armrests.

I'll be going for the Passion now for sure - no doubt about it. Yellow w/red interior :thumbup: leaving the trim black instead of silver though I may change my mind about that.

Well after finding out I'll get my car in Nov 08 - Jan 09 I decided to try the "orphan list" (unsold cars that were reserved - reservation holders are supposed to get first dibs). 3 weeks and nothing - last Sunday I figured Monday I'd make it my goal to annoy the heck out of the dealer until they got me a car. I was quite vocal, but in a nice way, that I would be that annoying guy until they gave me what I wanted. That was at 0800, by 1200 I had a phone call from them saying they had a car for me.

Sooo, that being said I'll do a review once I have it. Of course it'll probably be a bit biased. I also need to dig out my flak vest to protect me from the naysayers. So far, talking to other US Smarties - most seem to be hanging around 45MPG and these people aren't driving like Hypermilers. I look forward to getting it.