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Old 02-27-2022, 03:42 PM   #1
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EV battery range needs

How much range do you really need?

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Old 02-27-2022, 07:26 PM   #2
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A rule of thumb I once claim across for EV conversions was known as a rule of thirds. You wanted enough an EV range where two thirds covered your normal daily round trip, with the final third there to cover range loss from weather, detours, and errands. Going by that, most Americans will be fine with a range of 120 to 170 miles.

When I go EV, I may get longer range, because it would let me skip installing the Level 2 charger. Replace what I can with slow overnight charging, and get a full charge over weekend.

For those that will keep a car forever, a larger battery could mean the car remains usable for a longer as there is a bigger buffer of capacity to absorb the capacity loss.
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Old 02-27-2022, 10:40 PM   #3
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The stated range of EVs is misleading. First off, no one let's thier range dip below 30-40 miles the same as an ice, you wouldn't risk running out or not being able to find a charger. Then not many people charge to 100% anyway, it's impossible to that on a rapid charge anyway, but it's also bad for the battery. So you can easily knock 40% off the range before you even set off.

Then you have the fact that the range is over exsadurated too, even on the wltp cycle. If you have a roof rack, or a cycle carrier, or 4 people in the car, the range is reduced even more. Carwow did a test recently, when towing a small caravan, the cars range dropped to a third of what it should be, 100 miles instead of 300. That's the same as getting 10 MPG in a car rated at 30 MPG.

I looked an e208 the other day, small city car with a stated 211 mile range. But the display read 26 miles at 50%. Taking into account the 20% battery safety buffer at each end, you'd be looking to charge every 35 miles or so...
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Old 02-28-2022, 03:11 AM   #4
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I realistically need an EV that will do 100 miles on a cold winter's night.
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Old 02-28-2022, 07:44 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Draigflag View Post
The stated range of EVs is misleading. First off, no one let's thier range dip below 30-40 miles the same as an ice, you wouldn't risk running out or not being able to find a charger. Then not many people charge to 100% anyway, it's impossible to that on a rapid charge anyway, but it's also bad for the battery. So you can easily knock 40% off the range before you even set off.

Then you have the fact that the range is over exsadurated too, even on the wltp cycle. If you have a roof rack, or a cycle carrier, or 4 people in the car, the range is reduced even more. Carwow did a test recently, when towing a small caravan, the cars range dropped to a third of what it should be, 100 miles instead of 300. That's the same as getting 10 MPG in a car rated at 30 MPG.

I looked an e208 the other day, small city car with a stated 211 mile range. But the display read 26 miles at 50%. Taking into account the 20% battery safety buffer at each end, you'd be looking to charge every 35 miles or so...
WLTP is better than NEDC, but EPA window sticker is still closest to on the road. Average reported fuel efficiency here is very close to EPA combined on the models I've looked at. Divide WLTP by 1.12 for an EPA estimate.

The e208 might get 190 miles of range on the EPA. The dash display is like a the one for a tank's distance to empty. It is an estimate based upon past fuel consumption. Hard accelerations, high speeds, and idling with HVAC on will quickly drop the value.

A 30mpg car probably only gets 10mpg while towing. I still wouldn't get a BEV for towing at this time, but it is a big efficiency hit to nearly anything. Go to tow a lot, diesels generally have a lower efficiency loss.

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Originally Posted by JockoT View Post
I realistically need an EV that will do 100 miles on a cold winter's night.
Something with an EPA range of 150 miles should do.
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Old 02-28-2022, 01:14 PM   #6
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Here is my two cents on this subject:

My Chevy Volt is rated at 51 miles of range.

After 4 years and 40,000 miles I get 49 miles per charge in the summer.

In the cold winter nights -20C, I get 30 miles per charge.

I will start towing my motorcycle to the race track this spring and will see how that affects the electric range. But if I run out, the generator will just take over. I already tested the towing capability of the car last summer and had no issues with towing at 70 mph.
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Old 03-01-2022, 06:41 AM   #7
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"In the cold winter nights -20C, I get 30 miles per charge."

On nights that cold, you'd be better off switching over to hybrid mode to get waste heat from the engine. At least in the beginning of the trip to get the cabin toasty.

The Volt uses resistant heaters while in EV mode that suck down the battery. Many BEVs available these days have heat pump options that reduce the winter plenty. Even some PHEVs might too. The Toyota Prius and Rav4 PHEVs do.
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Old 03-01-2022, 10:14 AM   #8
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I just leave the car in Automatic. When it is below freezing outside, the generator always turns on with a "Engine Running Due to Outside Temperature" message on the dashboard. It runs until the coolant temperature reaches 63C and doesn't turn on until it falls below 47C. Even when the car is plugged in outside and it is 100% charged, when I remote start the car it turns on the generator to warm up the coolant to heat the cabin and condition the battery. When it shows 100% fully charged, it is actually 95% to increase battery longevity. When it shows the battery as 0%, I believe it's at 15% for the same reason.

When it's above freezing outside, the generator only comes on when I run out of battery.
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Old 03-02-2022, 03:24 PM   #9
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I know the Prius has the lion's share but I was surprised when the Volt was discontinued. It is a great looking car and seemed to offer a lot for the money.
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Old 03-02-2022, 05:46 PM   #10
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The Volt was cancelled alongside the Impala, Regal, and CT6. The large sedans lost out to SUVs, and the Volt wasn't selling enough to warrant moving to a new factory when GM closed the plant.

There are two Buicks in China using the Volt drivetrain.
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