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Old 07-31-2007, 08:06 PM   #1
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Fridge open for 6 years

"Switching from an average car to a 13 mpg SUV would use as much energy as leaving your refrigerator door open for six years."

According to the Sierra Club, driving an SUV is equivilent to:

Leaving a fridge open for 6 years, leaving the bathroom light on for 30 years, or leaving the TV on for 28 years. (No idea how a TV is similar in usage to a lightbulb.)

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Old 07-31-2007, 09:34 PM   #2
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i hate suv's so much!

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Old 08-01-2007, 10:20 AM   #3
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SUVs are just a convenient target. I'd rather see VW minivans taken off the road than SUVs, as they pollute more being owned by hippies that believe everyone should be required to cut pollution but they shouldn't bother spending a nickel to put new rings in their engine. When I had my SUV, I once sat in a bank drivethru in the next lane over from an old VW minivan, the whole back of the van was plastered with bumper stickers claiming that SUVs were destroying the environment. When they started the van, the cloud of oily smoke was so thick the stickers were no longer visible. That van pumped out more pollution starting up than my SUV pumped out in a year. SUVs also get very similar mileage (within 5MPG) to minivans, but have more capability to haul a load and are far more capable in bad weather, provided the driver isn't an idiot. Modern SUVs are also far cleaner and more efficient than many older cars.

It would be better if the Sierra Club focused more on the really big polluters, like the Northeast. Let's get rid of those 100 year old oil burning heaters that were in use before the word "emissions" existed. So much crude is used to make heating oil that the price of crude can be affected by 10-15 dollars depending on how cold winter is in the Northeast.

Why does the Sierra club attack SUVs, but you never hear them say a word about oil burning furnaces? Because an oil burner which is hidden in the basement is not nearly as pretty a target as the SUV even though they do far more environmental damage. True, we need get the soccer moms out of the SUVs and limit them to the workhorse environment for which they should be designed (the SUVs, not the soccer moms , but we'd do far better to end burning oil to heat houses.

Crude should be reserved only for portable energy requirements, stationary energy requirements should be provided exclusively by electricity. To do that, we'd need more nukes, more hydro, more solar, more wind, more wave generators. Limiting crude to mobile power sources would likely double or triple the amount of crude available, and since mobile power sources are far more regulated on emissions outputs the pollution would likely drop to 10 percent or less of what it is now.
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Old 08-01-2007, 01:33 PM   #4
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Umm, there are a million SUV's out there, and 95% have a single driver with no load. So I think they are a good target. But yes there are many other sources of pollution and waste too.
I can't even remember the last time I saw a VW micro bus, But I think Clench owns one LOL.
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Old 08-01-2007, 07:40 PM   #5
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lol the ammount of vw busses left in the world in crappy condition is probably less than 1% theres tones of restored ones but thier in tip top running/driving shape. that and its only a tiny 4 banger so it cant be polluting that much. suv's are truley pointless tho. i mean who needs to carry 8 people all teh time AND be able to crawl up a mountan?
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Old 08-01-2007, 10:51 PM   #6
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fuel economy forum
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Old 08-02-2007, 12:28 AM   #7
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Welp, FWIW, the impact of pollution depends where you live. In dense, warm areas like CA that have natural areas where pollution tends to clump, I can see the point of strict smog standards. But in BFE, it's not as big of a concern imo.
Originally Posted by FormulaTwo
I think if i could get that type of FE i would have no problem driving a dildo shaped car.
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Old 08-02-2007, 11:51 AM   #8
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Wow, it's either or, 100 percent, no shades of grey here eh? Either you must hate SUVs or kill anyone that says bad about them by pumping their lungs full of gasoline and lighting them up eh? And here I got rid of my own SUV.

My point about this was, why target only SUVs? It's a convenient, attractive target, but is far from being a top polluter or even a top fuel waster. Trucks use just as much fuel as SUVs, but nobody hates trucks. Yet SUVs are trucks with more interior room. How about them crew cabs? They use more fuel than SUVs, but nobody ever goes after them. And when attacking SUVs, is it just the full size ones or all of them? Some of the small ones get almost 30MPG, should their owners go to Hell or is Heck good enough for them? So far as only having one person to a vehicle, you'll never get away from that. People go to work and back, and there isn't necessarily anyone living near to carpool with.

What's worse, nobody said a word about the stationary boilers of the Northeast, which pollute far more than all the SUVs put together do. All you did was slam me for daring to defend the SUV as having a purpose in life. Burning a portable fuel source in a stationary system makes far less sense than running an SUV does. And the only real problem with the SUV is how it's been perverted into a status symbol. So I state again, people rail against the SUV because it's a convenient, attractive target, but won't do what is necessary to eliminate true polluters.
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Old 08-02-2007, 02:02 PM   #9
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omgwtfbyobbq -

Originally Posted by omgwtfbyobbq View Post
Welp, FWIW, the impact of pollution depends where you live. In dense, warm areas like CA that have natural areas where pollution tends to clump, I can see the point of strict smog standards. But in BFE, it's not as big of a concern imo.
That's why I have no problem with the original "farm truck" emissions law that became the SUV loophole. In agriculture, the population density is so much lower that the harm to people is so much less.

In LA in the Valley, I *never* experience the shortness of breath that I experienced in the beach cities in the 1970's. There's no comparison. The air is cleaner with maybe twice as many cars.

I don't remember the exact phrase, but Native Americans originally called LA something "valley of smoke" because even before there were cars, the air was already hazy.

Old School SW2 EPA ... New School Civic EPA :

What's your EPA MPG?
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Old 08-02-2007, 02:30 PM   #10
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Northeasterner here. My house has an oil burner heater.

Aside from apparently the Sierra Club isn't against oil heat - in this climate, and with electric power prices as they are, electricity is not a reasonable way to heat a home.

Furnaces don't last forever, they do get replaced with more modern cleaner burning ones.

Oil works very well and is reasonably economical. I suspect that propane or piped natural gas are also effective and economical but not all homes hav piped gas and not everyone wants a tank of flamable propane behind their house. Some use wood in its various forms but it's not as available as oil.

Currently getting +/- 50 mpg in fall weather. EPA is 31/39 so not too shabby. WAI, fuel cutoff switch, full belly pan, smooth wheel covers.

Now driving '97 Civic HX; tires ~ 50 psi. '89 Volvo 240 = semi-retired.
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