Drat...maybe that wasn't gas after all.
 

What a mess...

My last tank was ok. I ran it down to a few gallons then put in a bottle of Techron, which I had hanging around. I figured it's never gotten any fuel cleaner in 184,000 miles so it deserves something. Then I drove it to E, added 2 gallons, then drove it to E again to get the Techron through in concentrated form.

If I had known what I was going to do next I would have waited or skipped it entirely.

So today I was consolidating the various cans of old gas in my yard and trying to decide what to do with it. I decided I'd put it in the truck along with a full tank of gas. Bad idea. I put in nearly 4 gallons of old gas, some of which I'm not not sure was gas at all. Then I topped it off with 18.3 gallons of fresh stuff.

A few seconds after starting the truck, it started shaking badly. I didn't want to sit there idling like that but the traffic was awful (everyone was out doing stuff because we finally got a day off from the rain). I stumbled across the street to WalMart, where I bought a bottle each of Heet, Stabil, and SuperTech gas additive. Driving home, I found that above 2500 rpm it runs smooth. Under 2000 it stumbled and misfired (throwing a P0300 and making the Service Engine Soon light flash) and had no power. So, I kept it in 2nd and 3rd to keep it running smooth.

After ~5 miles, as I was almost home, it smoothed out and seemed to run normally even at idle. I figure the additives worked but took that long to mix in thoroughly and get to the engine.

Lesson learned...even if there's a whole 4 gallons of old gas, find a place to properly dispose of it instead of trying to use it, or just use it in very small increments.

If it resumes running bad, I'll have to find out how to drain the gas tank. At least I've now got enough empty, clean gas cans to hold all 24 gallons. You can bet I won't be discarding that much gas, but I won't try to run it all at once either.

I am such a cheapskate that I did the same thing a month ago. All for 2 gallons of stale gas that I thought smelled marginal.

I used the dilution method as well- the resulting aggravation wasn't worth the $5 I thought I was saving.

I put (wild guess) 5-8 gallons of gas at least a year old in my truck and it was ok. BUT it was premium from a car that was parted out. I had the car a year before putting the gas in my truck and who knows how old it was before that.

possibly the not-gas parts were the real culprits or it was a lot worse than mine.

I always dump Isopropyl alcohol in any gas that's been sitting around before using it.

Worst gas I had recently was when I was short for my mower at the beginning of spring, and I had a can sitting around with 3 or 4 years worth of fuel filter drainings in it... this stuff was yellow, looked like a cross between light machine oil and pee... in it went... gah... didn't start too well, in goes 4 oz of methanol (I was out of IPA) and I shake it up some, get her started, do the front and back lawns, and was trying to hack down an overgrown bed and stalled it, couldn't get it going again... maybe just maybe I should have fresh gas in there... gave up for the day.... so a week later I drained the half jar of milky syrup that was left, and put fresh gas in, and she fired up fine.

I had an interesting experience with bad gas about a week ago. I took our 4-stroke weed eater down off its hanger on the garage wall, carried it outside and started messing with the coupler on the boom so I could take off the blower attachment. I look down, and the damn thing is peeing on my foot. I set it down and take a closer look... At first glance, it appears the fuel return line had pulled out of its hole in the fuel tank. I grab the line to try to push it back into the hole, only to discover that the line barely reaches the tank. As I'm trying to figure out what's going on, the fuel line disintegrates in my hand!
Long story short, the gas had gone south over the winter, gummed up the carb a little and somehow turned corrosive enough to attack and break down the fuel lines. I must have brushed against the return line when carrying the trimmer outside, severing it where it passed into the tank. I had to take the whole thing apart, clean out the old gas (which now smelled like paint thinner) and fuel line fragments in the tank and go scour the local hardware stores to find lines that would fit. I'm putting stabil in the power equipment gas from now on.

Dad doesn't use Stabil, before storing any power equipment for an extended period of time he always just let it sit and idle in the driveway until it ran out of gas.

I have a generator powered by a Honda 8hp engine that I never use but I try to remember to run it once a month in the summer so it doesn't rot. I shut it off by turning off the fuel supply valve and letting it run the carburetor bowl dry. I do try to keep semi-fresh gas in it.

It starts easy every time. :)

Well, I let it sit until today. I just went out to start it and it didn't want to start. I had to open the throttle for it to start. Then it put out a puff of smoke when it started and ran rough. I shut it off when it felt like it was going to stall anyway.

Do I try again and hope it gets running smooth after a few miles like last time? Do I siphon the gas out?

There doesn't seem to be a way to drain it. I checked the Haynes manual and I crawled under, the only way in to the gas tank is at the top. I could take off the bed and remove the fuel pump or filler hose, I guess.

Just siphon it out...

That's what I was afraid of. That's a nasty, messy job, unless I get something nice for it. I have a hose with a hand-pump primer for siphoning but I'm not sure it will reach into the tank, and I'm pretty sure it won't empty the tank as much as I want -- I could end up in the same bind if there's 5 gallons left.

You've already got a pump set up to drain the tank... You just need it to drain to somewhere useful. Find a convenient fuel line junction to disconnect, and direct it into an appropriate container. Find the fuel pump relay and short the contact terminals, or if the pump wiring is easy to access, find a connector and power it directly with a battery or something. Just make sure the area you're working on is free of fuel vapors.

I was thinking of that, but it sounds like I'll break something. Those fuel pumps are expensive. :(

I'm sitting there squeezing the siphon primer, I look just like an old farmer stereotype milking a cow...so the truck gets a new name. Bessy it is!

Ok, siphoning is done. Now I must use the truck's fuel pump, or I have to take the bed off / drop the tank. I got out 21 gallons and then I couldn't get the siphon hose dipped into any gas anymore. There's 3 gallons left and I have a suspicion that those are the worst 3 gallons.

Double drat. I can't get the fuel filter off. I guess I shouldn't have let it spend the last 184,000 miles corroding and fusing to the fuel line. Not good.

I tried penetrating oil and I tried freezing it (with upside-down canned air). I'm sure not going to try heating it with a torch! I also am not willing to cut it off, that'll make plenty of sparks...

How about cutting on both sides of the filter with some heavy duty diagonal pliers and then using high pressure fuel hose, hose clamps and a barbed type fuel filter (high pressure type) to bridge the gap you will leave?

If the metal hose gets crimped shut as you cut it, use one of these and cut back from the crimped section:
https://tbn3.google.com/images?q=tbn:...ngCutter_4.jpg

:( I want to avoid splicing. I think if I'm going to do that I'll just buy new lines instead. I guess it depends how much they cost.

lol ive "fixed" someones mower doing that. they brought it to me sayign it wont start/stay running i look in the gas its full. i ask how old it is they said maybe a year lol well after about 10 minutes of messing with other stuff and finding out it will run if i spray somehting combustable into the air intake and it spudders to life then dies. well i drained the old gas that to my suprise looked like iced tea (year old my butt) put fresh stuff in and it fired right up!

funnily enough I got that mower as "dead, for parts" 'coz it had 2 stroke mix in it, when it's a 4 stroke B&S.... if I'm interpreting the serial # stamp right, it was made in 1968.

I can remember when my sister first got married she was way too poor to buy a mower. They could barely afford the house payment. Dad & I went to the dump, and picked the best looking mower out of the pile and threw it in the truck. Dove it home, drained the crankcase and fuel tank and refilled it with fresh oil & gas and it fired right up.

things are tough here and now, as well. my gas mower carb crapped out, so i priced new ones(mowers)...:eek:

decided to have it rebuilt until i realized it is cheaper to order a new one...$22 + $7 shipping. done deal!

Wow, where are you finding it at that price? What mower is it for?

it's for a HUGE Briggs 20 inch, 3.5 hp! obviously the efficient equivalent to a 3 cyl car.

here's the site...https://www.psep.biz/store/briggs_and...FQtN5QodD1Bc-w

the home page...https://www.psep.biz/index.htm

maybe we should add it to maximilian's list of suppliers thread.

Done.

Well, I've gotten the front/outbound side of the fuel filter loose, but the rear/inbound side won't budge. I bought PB Blaster today (I was using Shimano penetrating oil, which makes all the same claims) but it doesn't seem to be helping.

I'm now considering dremel-cutting the nut just enough to loosen it...

I know I've seen nut splitters someplace or other. It's a tool that cradles one side of the nut and lets you thread a blade sort of thing down against the other, cutting into it. I don't know if it would work in your particular situation, but it might be worth looking at.

I have a set. They won't work because I can't get them on; they're closed like a box-end wrench but I'm working with fuel line. If they made one shaped like a flare wrench that might work, and I considered trying to cut mine...

Can you crush the fuel filter and cut through it with a pair of bolt cutters?

I thought about that, but even if I did then its nut would still be stuck to the fuel line nut. I don't think I could anyway, there's no room for opening bolt cutter handles and I doubt I could flatten it enough anyway.

Someone on another forum suggested that if I've already given up and declared the fuel line dead, I've got nothing to lose; so I could remove the filter and line as an assembly. Then I could work on them while not laying under the truck. I can then drain them, rinse them so there's definitely no fuel in them, and use heat.

I need to find out how much a new line costs and if it's inexpensive enough I'll just quit and buy one, assuming I can figure out how to disconnect/reconnect it.

Hooray!

I got it loose! As Slaid Cleaves said in "Drinkin' Days", sometimes you gotta act like you've got a pair. So, I made a bid for the Darwin Awards.

I cut into the fuel filter's nut, slotting it with my dremel's diamond cutoff wheel most of the way to the thread. Some sparks flew but not a lot. I had wiped up the area so there were no pools/drops of fuel around. I couldn't get all the way across the width of the nut but two corner cuts did the job. It wasn't enough to crack the nut but it relieved enough stress on the nut for me to brute-force the nuts until they were persuaded to cooperate.

For how badly it was stuck, the threads sure look clean and uncorroded. WTF?

https://lh3.ggpht.com/_oNsRR_T1Qx0/Sm...0/IMG_3360.JPG

The saga continues. I ran the fuel pump and I don't think I got a whole gallon out. I'm pretty sure there should be at least 3 gallons of the worst stuff still in there.

Can you jack it to tilt more towards the pump inlet?

I jacked around for 30-40 minutes, it didn't help. I'm not sure where the inlet is, though.

Would removing the fuel sender give you access to the tank? My car's is well positioned for this but my old truck sure wasn't.

How about diluting whats left with 3-4 gallons of fresh gas, rock teh truck back and forth and then pump as much out as possible with the fuel pump. Then put a can of heet in, refill and hope for the best.

Or do you think that the pump pickup is clogged? 3-4 gallons is a lot to be left that the pump can't suck up.

The only way to access the sending unit on a late model GM truck is to either drop the tank, or remove the bed.

The sending unit is attached to the fuel pump, I'm pretty sure.

I'm not confident in diluting it, plus that would cost me $60-70 and I'd use up all my gas cans, making myself unable to fill the tank again after pumping it out. I'm not confident in diluting it since I tried that already and I think it didn't mix, I think the bad stuff stayed at the bottom.

After all that, I may still have to drop the tank/take off the bed. :(

https://www.tvworthwatching.com/werts...ankenstein.jpg

It's alive!!!!!!

Took bed off, removed the fuel pump (big struggle with the retaining ring), emptied more gallons from the tank (total of over 24 gallons removed now from my 24 gallon tank), replaced fuel filter, struggled with retaining ring reinstalling fuel pump, bought new retaining ring for a whopping $26 (for a stamped out piece of steel!), failed to connect fuel pump ground strap, nearly committed suicide when I found out a fuel pump costs $300, moped around for a few hours, spent a half hour tracing wiring diagrams, went back out and re-tested fuel pump connector, reconnected ground strap, started truck.

Wow- how did you hoist the bed off? I bet the bed was unwieldy and awkward to move around.

It's far easier than I thought. I could have completely removed it with one helper. Alone, I lifted one side, put some lumber under it, then lifted the other side and put lumber under it...repeatedly until it was high enough to slide backwards far enough to reach the fuel pump. I did have the tailgate off and the bedliner removed to make it lighter. The tailgate is pretty heavy.

Some damn fine structural engineers designed that thing. It's been tough as nails when I've thrown cinderblocks and rocks in it and loaded it with well over a ton of various types of stuff; it's very lightweight (gotta be under 200 pounds, I'm more fat than muscle); it's mostly self supporting; and it's designed to aesthetically match the rest of the truck.

After so thoroughly emptying the tank (I even sopped up the puddles with rags), dumping in the cans of gas I bought, and then idling it for 15-30 minutes, I drove it 7 miles and then topped off the gas. The total amount of gas it took from dry to full (including the idling and 7 miles) was 27.9 gallons. The gas tank is not shaped in a reasonable way, and I'm not sure what the point is; much of it is not accessible to the fuel pump.

They had some great engineers on most of the truck but they missed a spot with the fuel tank and fuel pump.

There's also a few gallons missing from my accounting; I guess when I was struggling to get it home with bad gas in it I must have used 2 or more gallons for a 7.7mi drive.