As I indicated earlier, people on this board are more polite than SaturnFans.

Also I'm glad I don't have to be a Global Socialist on The Road to Serfdom to be enthusiastic about saving gas; this may be different from what some have stated above. I'm instinsically cheap, I don't like wasting resources in general (planet, household, employer, whatever), and religiously documenting MPG gives me a great opportunity to flex that undiagnosed-OCD brain muscle!!!

:D

Q: What is the number one most effective way to consume less fuel?

A: Drive less.

Seems to me like that should be where all discussions begin on fuel economy - even if it is only implied the majority of the time.

When considering the cost of a commute, many seem to just think of it terms of fuel consumed vs. miles driven, but what is their time worth? For me, it's $26/hour to start. If I were commuting 35 minutes each way to work every day (a not uncommon commute for many in a large city) , I would be throwing away $26 worth of my time every day vs. living someplace within 5 minutes of work. That's $26 x 48 weeks x 5 days = $6240 every single year. Now throw in an extra few dollars per day in fuel saved and that figure easily approaches $7000 EVERY SINGLE YEAR in savings.

Given that arguement, don't you think it's worth pointing such issues out to people - even if it's not what they wanted to find?

Granted, that assumes that one could be productive and earn a similar wage for the time saved and that living closer to work really is an option, but most people I know would love to make their same pay and have more free time. Commuting long distances is simply a way of selling your worth short and wasting fuel in the process.

Yeah that is one thing that really gets me upset. I am ok with people driving excessively big/fast cars, but I hate to hear about people who drive 50-100 miles (or more) a day to work.

I should also add, that I have always enjoyed gassavers because there never seems to be any Nazi moderation and everybody generally gets along fairly well.

There are MANY excellent reasons to treat newcomers poorly! Keep the great ideas coming! Remember, if they aren't doing what you would do, they are doing it WRONG!

There was definitely some of that going on with some of those newcomers. But was it productive to bullwhip them until they left? Nah. I would have preferred that they had stayed around and figured out for themselves that they were mistaken.

The argument is certainly valid, and should be made. It's just that people kept saying it over and over, in increasingly derogatory ways. Ideas must be exchanged, since that is the point of being here. But people do not need to be beaten up until they give up and leave.

If you were doing something that was hurting someone else, would you care? Would you be defensive if someone tried to point it out to you?

If 2 people pull the trigger on a gun aimed randomly and someone else dies, are they less guilty by half? What if it was millions of people pulling on the trigger (by strings or whatever, work with me here)?

I'm getting the impression you are trying to shame us Bill. :o

There are a huge number of "extreme commuters" https://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/...-commute_x.htm
I used to be one. All I can say is I didn't want to be one, and now I pay $425 more in rent every month not to be one. I personally enjoy driving, but the commute was no joy. If I knew about the site I would have been able to save some gas. Maybe even some sanity. But then again, everyone around here thinks that hypermiling is insane.