Pwm
 

Well, now I'm a lil upset. my pwm fried. I paid $200 for it, and it overheated and burnt up inside. Gowsh Darn it. I was only running my unit at 15 AMPS. go figure.



Why can't it just be plug it in with an adapter and be done. Like phones are and everything else.

Is HHO the way to go?
 

Sorry to hear about the PWM, but you have to remember that all these tings are being made by a single person for the most part and there are bound to be problems allong the way. I have heard of allot of PWM's blowoing up, usually its one of the capacitors (youtube Zerofossilfuel had his own prototype blow a cap. on video). It souns like you were making progress on the MAP enhancer, may I suggest you disconnect the battery to reset the vehicle to stock and then play with the MAP enhancer, you may get better results.

Ya, I was getting results and the PWM got so hot. This one is current controlled.
I'm guessing they get really hot if you have too much baking soda in the thing as I loaded it up quit a bit, and then the amps wanted to go up and the pwm wouldn't let it. So that is my guess.


I HAVE THE diagram on how it was built, I just need to know the parts and i could start building them myself. as it looks like it is $20 in parts lol.


I am hoping next week I can continue my expirements.


I wish I had someone in North Dakota to help me out with this.

I think I'm going to just find the right electrolite to use for under the amount of AMPS i want, and then when it warms up, i'll tell it to use this many amps and not to go past it. Maybe that will work, I dunno. Will find out soon enough I guess.

I didn't think the amount of electrolite mattered with a pwm anymore once you had thaat part installed.

Right now I have a ELM327 scan tool. and I have a Map sensor, however I can't find any software to read my MPG.

anyone/?

Map / Efie
 

Just wondering abotu the MAP Enhancer and O2 sensor mod.

I am going to do the O2 extender instead of an EFIE.

Now, on how this works?


the Map Enhancer is for when the computer goes into open loop mode? it doesn't affect anything on closed loop? or is it vice versa.


The 02 extender affects the closed loop mode?

Having trouble understanding, if your suppose to run on closed loop, why use a Map enhancer?

And...

when i'm on closed loop, why does my map enhancer still make a difference?


Thanks,

Will

the way I understand it is that:

in closed loop, the ECU looks at both sensors
in open loop, the ECU ignores the o2 sensor and uses an internal fuel curve

in open loop, you usually run more gas because usually open loop is requiring more power from the engine. that is a big reason that we like to stay away from open loop around here. for example. in closed loop, I run an a/f ratio of 14.7 (like most cars do) If I punch it, my a/f ratio goes to 12.5 or so. doesn't seem like much but it makes a big difference.

also remember that the o2 extendors just take the o2 sensors out of the direct path of the exhaust and have not worked for everyone. you may want to read up on them before going through all the trouble.

I also recomend doing other mods to your car that will help mileage. so many people think that HHO will do so much for their mileage that they don't even consider a scangauge, warm air intake, grill block, just pumping up tire air pressure.

and thanks for updating your gas log. that looks more like the civic you describe.

It works !!!
 

16 MPG to 24 MPG 2008 F-150

Thanks,
Chris

Thanks
 

ya, I want that civic to do better, you said warm air intake?

is having the air warmer better? In north Dakota, the winters get cold.
But I'm trying here.

Anyways, you know of a way to have the air heated up besides sticking a blow dryer in their? lol.


I should have my pwm back next week.

Thanks :)

Also, what other mods are you thinking about that can be done? thanks

what you do is plug the inlet of your air box and make a new inlet into the engine bay. you can further heat the air by routing ducting to the exhaust manifold. my temps have seen 179 degrees at the highest.

I would suggest if you want to find out what works and what doesn't, read up on some peoples garages. there are several people that have done many things to better their mileage. some of it works and some of it doesn't. most people are very honest when it comes to gas logs and garage entries. I put down everything I have done so as to not repeat the past. remember also though, just because it did/didn't work for you doesn't mean it won't/will work for someone else. basically, results may vary.

there are several threads where people show indepth how to make a WAI for your car. they are all home-brews. it is not an aftermarket thing. mine cost me all of about $10 and that is because I had to buy some metal flashing that comes in a 10 foot roll and I needed about a foot of it.

Hho
 

Just wondering, what all do you hve to do to a grill, to make it run on hydrogen ?? as in a BBQ grill. Thanks

yeah it ignorance like this that does absolutley nothing to develop the idea. I think anybody that naysays something like that without having tried it out extensively has an opinonin that is totaly worthless and should not even be posted, because its a waste of your own energy first af all and its just a bunch of dogmatic bull**** anyway to discoulage others from proving your dead beliefs wrong. Why don't you get some real experience under your belt before you post your lame responses, and that goes for the rest of you doubting thomases also. Skeptics are usually on the lowest rung of the intelligence ladder. They should be flipping burgers for a living at miniumum wage with a IQ that low.

Vman,

you have some pretty harsh words for a fairly new member. calling people ignorant and on the lowest rung of the intellegence ladder. the beautiful thing about the internet is that you don't really know who you are talking to. I know several people with masters and doctorett degrees that can't figure out how you can get a net gain from HHO. I guess they should go back to flipping burgers and give up their six figure engineering positions.

HHO isn't a new thing and the people that claim big numbers usually have little to nothing to back it up with. you say that we should try it for ourselves. where is any proof that it works. a few random people that say it does, oh and they are selling a prototype if you want to try it, just go to THEIR web site.

so many people want to strap on a hydrogen generator to their car and get DOUBLE the mileage (still waiting for that too). it is easy to call people ignorant and stupid but what proof do you have of this working. I personally have plenty of proof of what I am doing that works (which I produce and sell none of). the proof is in my gas log. novel idea don't you think. start a gas log like all the rest of us that like to share information. maybe you are too intellegent to start one. maybe it is beneath you.

do you really believe in HHO? if you did, why wouldn't you have a gas log with proof of better mileage. better yet, what do you drive? what year? anything? you have been on here for over 2 months and this is all you have to add? seems like other people have more to add than you.

even jadziasman has a gas log...what about you? don't you believe in it? maybe you should be flippin' burgers beside the rest of us. I'll save you a spot at the grill.

*edit* note that no profane language was used in getting my point across.

Hey
 

Question for ya all

With Bronze Wool, when you make a torch, Do I ever have to worry abotu a flash back? like will the Bronze Wool burn away. If so, what Do I do to prevent this from happening again in the future? Thanks, Willii

Thought of an idea to control amps.

I think.

Ok, We basicly know baking soda and other things are an electrolyte that boosts the amps. NOw we need to keep it at a cold start for the amps.

Now, the electrolyte continues to draw amps without ever stoping wanting to draw more it seems like.

What if their was another powder or something we can put in as a delectrolyte. Ya know, something that doesn't like to draw amps, in fact, it would draw away amps.

So, maybe we could add enough of this to make it so you might have to add more baking soda or whatever, and add more of this other stuff to kick back on the current, then maybe you can have a 30 amp consistentsy.

I hope everyone understands this and I hope someone knows something that draws away amps.

I am thinking you will have to add more electrolyte, like 100 Amps worth, and then delectrolyte and bring it down to 20 amps or 30 or wahtever you wanna run it at. And then this should stop extra amps you gain over time.

Thanks.

Also please respond to the post above about the Torch so I can make a grill.

Alive
 

Did everyone die? No more responses?





-Will

I think the simple answer is to just use less electrolyte. Think of the following example...

I have a pot of water on the stove, and the burner is on high. I can toss in some ice every few minutes to keep it from boiling (your de-electrolyte), or I can just turn down the heat (use less electrolyte).

Pure water already slows the reaction down to almost nothing. That's why an electrolyte is needed to begin with. Adding too much electrolyte will cause your amps to go out of your desired range. so the simple answer is just use less electrolyte instead of finding another substance to counteract it.

-Jay

One way to warm up a series circuit HHO cell is to short out a pair of plates or two, to raise the amperage. Once it is up to temp, turn off the relay that is shorting the cells and it is back to being an efficient series cell. An example would be turning an 8 cell into a 6 cell by jumpering cells 1 and 8 with a switch.

I tried that and it works. But something odd happens. When you change it back to the full bank of series cells the currents drops to where it was when all the cells were cold. In other words, if one cell is cold, the current is limited by that cell.

I used power resistors in series J-B Welded to an aluminum plate as a heater. Works great.

Could just switch off a cell that's inbetween two or more hot cells. Then, the neighboring cells should warm it up for you?

I agree, only thing is, the cell keeps drawing a peek current.
I only have one hooked up for now and in the process of hooking up a second one.

The only problem is with HHO is it keeps on drawing current and never stops.

That is why I just thought of that idea.

I am in the process to wait for my pwm to return it is a pwm v2.0

Hope it works better.

Sorry I allready have the V2 pwm. Just getting it returned and hoping it will work better.

That works too, but I wanted it thermostatically controlled. The base plate heater warms it and a fan cools it on hot days. So far the heater has it up to temp within two miles (speed limit is 45).

In summer the fan cycles on and off once it reaches the temp I set it at. There is a green LED to indicate when the fan is running and red for heat.

Happy Thanksgiving
 

Just wanted to say Happy Thanksgiving and thanks for all the help so far.

Can't wait to see final results next week.

If you really want to make a more effecient engine with water just use WATER INJECTION. I'm not sure if this will work on an NA engine but a few of my friends use this for Drag Racing with their turbocharged 4g63 engines. It will ALLOW you to make more HP by reducing knock and allow you to advance the timing, but i'm not sure if you can use it to make the engine more fuel effecient. Just like reflashing turbocharged engines to run on E85 will allow you to up the boost on the turbo and make even more power (but takes more fuel). The problem with doing this is your engine and its tune becomes dependent and if you try to run on regular fuel without a re-tune you will blow your engine.

Note: You MUST reflash and or retune your ECU for this to work.


HHO kits are scams.

Seems to me HHO generators would break the law! The second law that is!

Can't quite see how you can expect to gain more energy from combining H and O than it takes to crack H and O! That's without the loses involved in the phase transitions.

I think you guys should play with magnets, they don't work either, but at least they aren't dangerous!

https://www.gassavers.org/gaslog/sig.php?id=2541

Soon to build my own
 

I posed the question; Is HHO the way to go? Now that I picked up my new car, I plan to do a home made HHO generator. Yes kits are expensive, so I'll do a PVC jug, with Hoax plates, better known as the 8 plate Home Depot stainless steel wall plates to sepparate the H and O in water. I got most of my information from Utube, Hoax or Sir Hoax used 8 plates and produced 2 litres of HHO a minute without a PWM. You can see the original 1979 home movies of Miller running a VW sand rail exclusively on HHO. Like I have said, HHO is a suppliment, it aids combustion, increases flame speed and scavanging fuel droplets from the combustion process. There is a video on Utube that shows the combustion cycle of a Taurus V6, someone stuck a micro camera in the side of the combustion chamber. Its a dirty, impercise process, you can see the flame dancing around and large unburned droplets swirling around and then blowing out the exhaust. In theory the HHO should scavenge up that unburned fuel and therby creating power by improving the combustion process.

Another one of my favorites is the Hot Air Engine, suggested by Smokey Yunick and now called the HCCI process or Homogenous Burn Cycle, its a take on super heating fuel to make it a gas and getting rid of the droplet effect and creating a super efficient combustion process. Look up Geet and Pantone, these are names associated with these processes.

For more nostalgia, look up Wick Carburation, this is the sort of inspiration that lead to getting fuel vapor rather than a fine mist into an engine. The carburator and the fuel injector can only get fuel droplets so small, its up to new technology to make it more efficient.

When I build my HHO generator, I will do a step by step build process and thoughrough testing and hopefully we can put the HHO controversy to sleep.

I mean look at it this way, I was ready to plunk down 100 bucks for those Pulse Plugs, then one guy here bought them and he got worse mileage.

Heaven Net, please be sure to do accurate experiments before declaring your own success. To date, we have not seen good data from people claiming success with HHO. We've seen good data on failed attempts, but the successes rarely even try to claim to have real data, let alone provide any credibility.

One thing we do support here is never buying HHO products; due to the nature of that industry, it is a bad idea to support it and any HHO work should always be DIY using parts bought from companies not in that industry.

Agreed.

Be sure to check out the Smack Booster. It's well thought out and easily replicated.

I'm yet to be convinced enough to bother despite the theory.

By the way, we're unlikely to be impressed by a baseline gaslog that isn't beating the EPA score at least by a little... it points towards a very out of tune vehicle, or careless gas thirsty driving. Just 'coz going from 12mpg to 18mpg isn't impressive if it's what the vehicle was supposed to be doing in the first place....

.... that's my excuse for not trying it yet, I never seem to reach a state where my vehicles are running 100% perfect, there's always some little intermittent problem, or suspicion of some part being "due".

Re: Is HHO the way to go?
 

good discussion.