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-   -   Extreme front airdam - a test (https://www.fuelly.com/forums/f9/extreme-front-airdam-a-test-8319.html)

landspeed 05-09-2008 11:01 PM

Extreme front airdam - a test
 
OK, I will be doing a semi scientific test tomorrow. I have just fitted a fairly extreme front airdam to 'Bluey II' (as well as a partial grille block and small rear wheel skirts - just the upper 1/3 of the wheel arch).

I never noticed a major difference with the last two, but I just went for a
quick test drive with the air-dam, and it seemed to be significantly more
economical.

Tomorrow, I am going to do a round-trip of 600 miles, and will see what my long-distance fuel economy is. I have some comparison tanks - I drove the same road a few months ago, in similiar weather conditions (actually it was a little warmer when I did the comparison tank). I'm hoping that the air-dam will make a significant difference to the economy on the journey tomorrow!

The total distance is 800 kilometres... It would be cool if I could do that all on one tank but I don't think that is possible. We will see... :)

I will post pics of the air dam + an analysis once the test is complete, later this weekend!

Antares2k6 05-10-2008 04:05 AM

I look forward to seeing those. Would like to see how the numbers work out. Anxiously waiting to see mpg for home made air dam.

Joel

flydelsolsi 05-10-2008 07:06 AM

Could you fiberglass or bondo a factory bumper to eliminate air pockets? Would it stick to a plastic bumper. That is an idea I have been kicking around.

GasSavers_RoadWarrior 05-10-2008 05:17 PM

Just "key" the surface well by crosscutting with 60 grit.

landspeed 05-10-2008 09:08 PM

OK, I will put photos up tomorrow (although I'm removing the airdam today as it has shown it is VERY effective, and I will start making a permanent one soon, with some improvements in aerodynamics.

I got just over 35MPG(us), in very suboptimal conditions (downhill at 110km/h with braking, and uphills so steep that the torque convertor unlocks. On my car it is a very 'slippery' torque convertor, so when it unlocks, the revs jump from e.g. 1900RPM to 2500rpm :O (causing a 25%-33% increase in fuel consumption with no benefit at all).

I accidently drove past my road on the way back, so ended up doing my 'commuting' run for a few kilometres. I could keep the Supermid at a 3.2ms injector pulse, and maintain speed, whereas usually (even when fully warmed up), I need 3.6ms. This was over a 2 kilometre stretch.

With Bluey I, the grille block did make a difference (and the rad block made a difference made a difference with Bluey II as well). The partial wheel skirts also probably made a difference - although I didn't notice it.

This air-dam, however, makes a ridiculous difference. The car sounds quieter when you drive, and you have to use noticeably less pedal to maintain speed. I think with my car, that aero-mods are the way to go. I think within the next few months I will have the second most extreme car on gassavers (and will save more fuel as no-one will want lifts in my car :) ).

Oh, and now I have nearly all the parts for a manual conversion (all the difficult to obtain parts). Also got a better exhaust manifold, two starter motors, and a spare alternator (which I think is going to be made into a wind turbine in a few weeks time, maybe to charge a 2nd-hand car battery, to charge my bicycle battery from :) ).

dieselbenz 05-10-2008 11:26 PM

I can't wait to see pictures of this thing.

Project84 05-11-2008 12:31 PM

My saturn has holes in the front bumper to allow air to pass on to the radiator and if I wanted to construct a good grill block, i'd have to cut into the bumper and remove some material that is in the way of making it a flush install. I'm worried about cutting it up for FE, but I have the material to install the grill block, and I'm kicking around the idea of an air dam too... this post has me thinking about my car more and more, I'm very excited to see pics of yours and read your FE improvement.

landspeed 05-11-2008 11:56 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Here is a pic of the car, during the final revision of the aero 'kit' :)

https://www.gassavers.org/attachment....1&d=1210578517

You can see partial rear wheel skirts, lower grille block (note, I removed the passenger side grille block, where the transmission is, due to engine coolant temperatures going too high). I actually just added the upper grille block (between the headlights) at this time. This was just prior to returning home on the journey. This configuration seemed to net slightly better MPG (but only about 1.5%), so this may just be random variation. I later removed the upper grille block as the air temperature went up later in the day. This made no difference to MPG, so the main frontal aero improvement seems to have been the air dam.

You can also see the front air dam. This was simply coroplast, duck-taped onto the front bumper, with three pieces of coroplast reinforcing it (braces) behind it. The centre one had a tube of coroplast reinforcing it. This held up to 62mph driving (70mph for a few minutes in total) without any problems, and also got grounded out a few times with no problems (except that it wore through the tape holding the reinforcing bars so I replaced this twice). Also note that it doesn't even go around the whole of the front bumper - it stops about 10cm short of the edge, reducing the efficiency of the airdam.

All this stuff has been removed now, but the mileage was amazing. The downside was the 'overheating' (it never overheated but went slightly above half on the gauge which I was not happy with). Once I get the manual gearbox, this will no longer be an issue (as I can generally use less petrol, producing less heat, and also do things like engine-off-but-in-gear coasting with the gas pedal held to the floor, and hot fans on full, for rapid cooling. You can't do this in the auto - and have to leave it idling down most of the hills to stop the bearings being destroyed.

So. the above was 'Version I' of the front air-dam + associated stuff.

Version II will be coming soon:

() Silver duck tape on hubcaps for cheap moon discs!

(a) Super Extreme Front Airdam (secondhand bumper from breakers yard... Airdam starting at the position of the numberplate (further forward), so even more air goes over the car instead of under (as it would 'lower' the point at which air decides to go either over or under the car. The airdam will also stick out forwards very slightly, so even more air goes over the car.

(b) Full rear wheel skirts (removable for tyre changes / tyre PRESSURES etc). I found this annoying when trying to pump up the tyres before the journey even with the partial wheel skirts but I was just lucky in terms of the air valve placement.

(c) Adjustable grille block (with manual choke cable as described elsewhere, on this site I think).

And then...

(d) Moderately extreme rear boat-tail as described earlier
(e) Wheel spoilers and boat tails
(f) Undertray later on

:)

theholycow 05-12-2008 02:42 AM

Is it just an illusion caused by the rear wheel skirts, or is the car a lot lower in the rear than the front? Looking at the side compared to the road it appears that the rear really is low and the front is high. Was that done on purpose, or is it just normal wear and you don't want to waste money on new springs?

ZugyNA 05-12-2008 04:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by landspeed (Post 99270)
All this stuff has been removed now, but the mileage was amazing. The downside was the 'overheating' (it never overheated but went slightly above half on the gauge which I was not happy with).

Strange thing about the overheating...because the air dam SHOULD help create a lower pressure area in the engine compartment...helping to "pull" air into the engine compartment?

Need to be sure the intake air isn't deflecting off the radiator instead of going thru it? If the low pressure area is in front of the rad (it is?)...the air might be going UNDER it? Make a crude duct? I think you want ALL air coming into the engine compartment to go thru the rad...and you want just enough air coming in to keep the temp gauge centered?

I'm sure you don't want the cooling fan running if you can help it. An indicator light on the hot wire to the fan will tell you when it actually runs...which should be only when stuck in traffic on a hot day?

GasSavers_RoadWarrior 05-12-2008 05:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by landspeed (Post 99094)
I got just over 35MPG(us), in very suboptimal conditions (downhill at 110km/h with braking, and uphills so steep that the torque convertor unlocks. On my car it is a very 'slippery' torque convertor, so when it unlocks, the revs jump from e.g. 1900RPM to 2500rpm :O (causing a 25%-33% increase in fuel consumption with no benefit at all).

I don't know if you can get it down there, but since you're junking that tranny anyway, you might want to try Universal Tractor Fluid in it for a bit instead of ATF. This is a tractor hydraulic fluid designed for hydraulics, transmissions, wet clutches and wet brakes, make sure you get the one for wet clutches and wet brakes. The advantages of this stuff are generally that it runs cooler, better lubricity, higher temperature tolerance, and a good package of friction modifiers for allowing firm TC lockup. It's been the secret "trick" fluid of many a drag racer. It's made from group 3 high VI oils, so it's as good as some stuff that lube companies are calling "synthetic" these days. The fact that it's designed for $50,000 commercial/industrial/agricultural trannies in harsh, severe duty environments, makes me think that it's better than ATF for $5000 trannies. However trannies specifically needing Ford Type F, Mercon V, or ATF +3/+4 should probably stick with those, but everything that needs the generic dexron/mercon stuff should handle it fine and quite likely improve.

Here in North America, a further bonus is that it is available cheaper than the cheapest ATF :D If you browse tranny fluid labels in the store, and compare the listed commercial applications, you'll see that only the expensive synthetic multivehicle fluids are approved for the same applications that the UTF is... so I figure you're getting something "worth" 3-4x the price in your vehicle....

Anyway, just figured on passing that on because I thought it might make your torque convertor behave a little better, firmer lockup and less slush, may also firm up shifting a tad.

landspeed 05-14-2008 10:29 PM

Just been searching and found this:

Posted by: Road Warrior Sep 5 2007, 07:56 PM
IMO anything that's not an A604 (or derived therefrom) will "live" with just about anything in it. If you wanna get funky with it, you can do what I did to my 3 speed and put TDH Universal Tractor Fluid in it

But then I just shiftkitted it and raised line pressure a tad too, so you might not attribute my perceived benefits to the fluid, which are, firm TC lockup at ~65-70kph, revs down to ~2600 at 100kph highway speed from nearer 3000. Also meant to run cooler than ATF and survive overheating better. But I suggest you do your own research online if you're interested in that.

https://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache...lnk&cd=3&gl=nz

Although I guess that is you :)

If it works in my gearbox, and if it reduces the torque convertor slipping... I think it is worth a try. My gearbox uses Dexron Type III ATF - I guess that means it should be OK with universal tractor fluid?

The other thing is, there is no way I can drain all the old fluid out - would that be a problem? I could maybe do 2-3 fluid changes to wash out most of it however (but would need to drive it between each change). Did you somehow empty all the old fluid from your transmission before adding the tractor fluid?

OK, Just read this too : https://www.mpgresearch.com/forum/vie...hp?f=49&t=1758

(Also by yourself, I presume)

OK, what do you think of this one:

https://www.trademe.co.nz/Business-fa...-154994721.htm

Any ideas? It is the only one I can find on google.co.nz under 'Universal Tractor Fluid'. However, if it isn't good, I will have a better look. This is the farming capital of New Zealand and we have many tractors, and also a degree of US influence (lots of V8 cars and so on), so it must be available - I might check out a farming store over the weekend!

ZugyNA 05-15-2008 05:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by landspeed (Post 99904)
The other thing is, there is no way I can drain all the old fluid out - would that be a problem? I could maybe do 2-3 fluid changes to wash out most of it however (but would need to drive it between each change). Did you somehow empty all the old fluid from your transmission before adding the tractor fluid?

* find a manual for your car...find the TOTAL fluid capacity for your auto

* look at the back of your radiator for the 2 cooling lines usually going into the bottom of it at back...either one will work, but you might need to add some temporary hose to direct fluid into a container.

* with the front up on ramps...put this line in a bucket...run the car at IDLE in NEUTRAL till the flow almost stops...shut it off. Best to put his fluid in a clear bottle to see it's condition and to measure it. Put this same amount back in the filler tube and repeat the process until you've replaced the fluid with the full capacity amount.

* during all this you need to be careful when removing the hoses on the rad...check their condition and replace them with rubber hose specifically made for this purpose if they are hard and brittle...use NEW clamps. Be very gentle with the hose barbs on the rad...or you might cause a leak.

* this will replace most of the fluid in the trans...might want to do this 1X per year. FIRST time you do it is is best to remove the pan...clean it out and replace the filter or screen BEFORE.

GasSavers_RoadWarrior 05-15-2008 05:38 AM

That looks like it might be the stuff. You'd want to read the back to see if it was okay for wet clutches and brakes, just to confirm it has the friction modifiers in it, there's also a couple of CAT and Allison specs that the stuff should meet, to help confirm it's suitable.

The "Name Brand" that the performance guys are using is John Deer Hy-Gard tractor fluid. Now there's a reason I didn't go for that... I have to deal with winter and Hy-Gard comes in two viscosities, normal, for "summer" and folks in the southern stats can drive that all year, and a low viscosity for winter. The Walmart TDH UTF I'm using is between those two, because I don't want to change out my tranny fluid twice a year. If I was further north, I might have gone for the low viscosity or a "winter" fluid for all year, but the specs of this one seem to match my climate better. It's good to -25C I think, whereas the regular Hy-gard starts gelling around -10, and the winter stuff is good down to -40 or -50C.

I originally had it in as just a "half" fill without draining the torque convertor or flushing, meaning I just dropped the tranny pan, changed the filter and filled back up with the UTF... At this time I had also modified the differential with a Ford Traction Lock "S" spring, to make it into a halfassed limited slip differential. However, this didn't hold up very well to street use, the temper of the spring changed due to lack of full custom friction coating work and getting hot in use, and it shattered inside the differential, punching a hole in the case... so I had to have the tranny open again to clean that mess up, patched up the hole with a "tinkers patch" and JB Weld, and refilled with UTF again, so, with the double change I've got about 90% UTF in there with just a trace of the old Dexron II/Mercon III. Actually, might have got diluted more than that, because I had a tranny cooler line spraying fluid last month and had to add another quart.

So, you don't wanna just take my word for it...
https://www.rosslertrans.com/RECOMMENDED%20FLUIDS.htm
Recommended for high HP transmissions there (Dunno why they don't say it for the lower HP builds, but by 1500HP, it's one of the only things that's gonna stand up to it)

https://www.mercedesshop.com/shopforu...d.php?t=187198
Couple of guys who like how it runs in their Mercedes

https://www.fordmuscle.com/forums/c4-...rans-good.html
Discussion on a Ford Forum

https://www.turbomustangs.com/smf/ind...?topic=58907.0
More ford people on it..

https://www.t6p.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3334
And the turbo buick crowd..

You'll see some claims in those that make your ears prick up like "better lubrication" "tightening up the torque convertor" which should all mean better transmission efficiency for the fuel economy driver.

As for where to get it, yes, farm supply places might be the best bet, ask if it's Hy-Gard equivalent/compatible and it should be the right stuff. Don't know what your prices will be like, here it seems the "name brand" stuff is on a par with the price of regular ATF.

8307c4 05-16-2008 07:38 AM

I bet you would've gotten more out of it by skipping that 600 mile drive :p

As for automatic transmission fluid changes, if you DIY every 10,000 miles then the drainage issue becomes insignificant. Interestingly enough 10,000 miles happens to be the recommended DIY interval.


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