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-   -   Transparency in the Top 10. (https://www.fuelly.com/forums/f2/transparency-in-the-top-10-a-9074.html)

Maillemann 06-20-2008 09:30 PM

Transparency in the Top 10.
 
I'm somewhat irregular in my forum activity here, so if this has been bandied about before, forgive me, but I feel the need to voice my concern.

Firstly, there seems to be the persistent issue of motorcycles and scooters ending up in the "gasoline" category. That's an issue I know has come up before, and while I find it annoying, it's not my main concern here.

Now and then I have noticed at least a few vehicles in the top 10 whose most recent tank(s) - or even their only(!) tank - covers a very few number of miles and is wholly unrepresentative of what most would consider a measurable "real-world" MPG figure.

Would it make sense to require a minimum total distance traveled before allowing entries to be counted towards the Top 10? Time and again we hear it told or tell others not to be so certain over changes - good or bad - in their MPG until they've seen a few tanks and accounted for all the variables. Why then allow singular and/or low-mileage entires to be representative of a vehicles true MPG performance?

cems70 06-21-2008 04:19 AM

I agree completely and would like to see a minimum distance traveled to qualify for the Top 10. I would also like to see motorcycles and scooters excluded. No offense to those who achieve great FE in these, but they just don't belong in the Top 10.

101mpg 06-21-2008 06:54 AM

I'd make this my personal crusade if I could get permissions to do so appropriately as a moderator. I've been bringing this up with the mods but as yet do not have tools or a specific person assigned to clean this up.

As one who is in the top 10 as far as % above EPA, this is something important to me. I've been analyzing my driving habits including a whole lot of EOI and neutral coasting which I'm trying to work into a thread for others who are interested in my personal methods. I know I have learned a lot from others' techniques.

Scooters and motorcycles and hybrids have categories, and these vehicles should not be in the gasoline section.

Rest assured you're being heard, even if we can't fix it as of yet.

101mpg 06-21-2008 06:54 AM

What minimum distance would you suggest, btw? I'd like to hear thoughts on this.

cems70 06-21-2008 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 101mpg (Post 107357)
What minimum distance would you suggest, btw? I'd like to hear thoughts on this.

I believe 12k or 15k is the annual car lease allowance and also the basis for many car manufactuer warranties (used to be anyway). Even AAA states that the average American drives 12,000 - 15,000 miles per year. So perhaps this or something close to it should be the minimum distance. At the same time, I don't think it's fair to exclude those who don't drive as much due to where they live (city or close to work), or due to personal choices (using bicycle or mass transportation). But there should be a substantial minimum distance to weed out those who only drive a few thousand miles per year.

Jay2TheRescue 06-21-2008 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 101mpg (Post 107356)
I'd make this my personal crusade if I could get permissions to do so appropriately as a moderator. I've been bringing this up with the mods but as yet do not have tools or a specific person assigned to clean this up.

As one who is in the top 10 as far as % above EPA, this is something important to me. I've been analyzing my driving habits including a whole lot of EOI and neutral coasting which I'm trying to work into a thread for others who are interested in my personal methods. I know I have learned a lot from others' techniques.

Scooters and motorcycles and hybrids have categories, and these vehicles should not be in the gasoline section.

Rest assured you're being heard, even if we can't fix it as of yet.

I don't know if that ranking page is run through vBulletin or not, but on vBulletin there are 2 classes of moderators. Moderators, and Super Moderators. I know that Super Mods have more powers than Mods, but I'm not exactly sure what is extra. I'm a mod on another vBulleitn forum, but they don't use the Moderator function. All mods on that site are Super Moderators. If the ranking page is run through vBulletin and you are a SuperMod I think you should be able to move a vehicle to another category, just as if you moved a thread to another category because someone posted it in the wrong area. Then again that function may only be available to those with vBulletin "Contractor" or "Administrator" status. It all depends on how the site was initially setup.

-Jay

Maillemann 06-21-2008 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 101mpg (Post 107357)
What minimum distance would you suggest, btw? I'd like to hear thoughts on this.

I had originally thought of something around a few thousand miles. I think that a year's worth of driving - while providing meaningful data - might rapidly dampen the spirits of many driven (haha) by the thrill of competition who want to get in on the game within a reasonable time-frame.

Since we list a 90-day running average why not figure on some mileage based on this? In the 3k range? For even the longest-ranged vehicles this would represent at least three tanks.

Otherwise, perhaps adopt the standard for some MPG record-setting requirement (Guinness Records or the like)? The EPA test cycle would be too short but maybe some other agency has an equivalent which could be appropriated.

bowtieguy 06-22-2008 03:47 AM

what about a minimum fillup? i see some that log quick fills of 2 or 3 gallons, presumably of a fantastic trip. this would make one's average inflated no?

for cars, a minimum of 8 US gal for example, might be warranted.

theholycow 06-22-2008 05:33 AM

Minimum quantity of fuel per fill can knock some people out of the running when they've greatly increased their mileage. I've been filling every 200mi because I'm eager to find out the results of my latest experiment; when I first got the car before I started hypermiling, that would have been enough for 8 gallons, but now that's 5 or 6 gallons.

I'm happy enough with the 90 day average. I wish it could reflect my latest strategies that I believe will be consistent from here on forward, but I understand that I really need to demonstrate results first. I can accept that some people who only drive a few hundred miles in 90 days can get an abnormal tank and beat me on the list, though I am not very competitive about it...I'm only vaguely interested in others' mileage, I'm too busy competing with myself. :D

bowtieguy 06-22-2008 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bowtieguy (Post 107524)
what about a minimum fillup? i see some that log quick fills of 2 or 3 gallons, presumably of a fantastic trip. this would make one's average inflated no?

for cars, a minimum of 8 US gal for example, might be warranted.

i checked and conclude that avgs are based on total miles driven. so, short fills do not inflate the #s. i stand corrected.


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