Fuel up glitch
 

Looked at my cars dash, my last fuel up registers as 63.2 MPG, but when I scroll down to the table where all fuel ups are listed, my last fuel up is showing up as 63.15 MPG. Not sure if that would mess things up, but worth noting as it's obviously a different calculation.

Looks like the Mini Log (table) is showing out to 2 decimal spots. But the graph, and Fuel Log page, and everywhere else is rounding it to 1 decimal spot.

So is this a glitch that needs fixing? Or just a querk? It will throw the figures off will it not?

I'll have Freddie look into it. It shouldn't throw any figures off. It's still using the same info you input in your fuel up, just rounding. I don't believe any of the stats go off of the rounded figures.

Much appreciated thanks. Also I switched to "US" to see if the same glitch occurred,and noticed a "potential savings" box, I've never seen this before, could this possibly be modified and added for UK users too as it's pretty neat? ;)

Speaking of glitches, can't see myself in the 2016 Prius list! Good news anyway - 60.81 MPG on my first tank beat the outgoing Hyundai i20s first tank of 60.74.
Not a fair comparison perhaps, as the Prius twice the price of the i20, but the Toyota actually feels like £26,000 worth of car, the Hyundai never felt worth £13,000.

Ben, you'll only show publicly after 3 fill ups, so get driving! Pretty good mileage for a first tank though, well done. I still think your Hyundai will work out slightly more economical, but as you said before, it's not all about economy, the Prius is bigger, comfier and better to drive, it's more interesting and you probably won't get bored with it either ;)

Also without being a stalker, but the cost per mile so far this year is the same for me and you in the Prius at 8.2 pence per mile, weird or what?! :D

Ha ha! Yes, I used Morrisons regular on the dummy fill to give me a full tank to zero, and Tesco Momentum 99 on my one measurable tank today. Told it is the highest octane available, so I ll give it a try! My i20 gave me 6 months of semi pleasure when averaging 70mpg, and 2 brief smiles for the 80 and 86 mpg tanks, but yeah, it wasn't an enjoyable car! Popped the Prius in power mode briefly, made it react a lot quicker! Using pulse and glide is more fun too, booting it up and then rolling down - lots of acceleration then charging and using the battery. It is a shame to watch the poor live feed when just the petrol engine is running (oh how much better a diesel would be...!) but then to get the free miles in EV, you can't really complain! Whatever a Prius is classed as, I am classing it as a big luxury car (from our perspective, inside with lots of room) - it feels no smaller than my Xantia or Rover 75 - seeing as mid 40s would be their best return on the same journeys, not bad!

I remember when you made a thread to showcase your new eco diesel Paul, think you payed about as much for the Clio as I did for the i20. I remember being shocked at how loaded it was with kit and toys - made a complete lie of Hyundai being a value company, I got nowt but a blue drive badge and ISG! This time round I've got more gadgets than I know what to do with!

You have to be careful when buying small cheap eco cars, some are built cheaply and have had very little development spent on things like suspension and comfort. Many lack character and are boring to drive. But mine luckily is fantastic, really punchy engine, superb chassis setup with super smooth suspension and excellent handling too, and as you mention plenty of toys too. I keep looking at cars because I'm a car guy, but luckily they are all unaffordable for me, so I'll be sticking with the little Clio for some time yet ;)

It must be very interesting to drive that Prius. I'm presuming it's automatic, how much the electric and gas are used? You don't have manual control over that?
I admit that I've done much better since my first couple tank fulls. Since getting rid of the ethanol. I'm fighting staying off the gas pedal. Keep lunging out of starts, etc.
I also agree on Toyota being a good value. They always seem to make one think they got their money's worth. Don't mean to turn this into a Toyota infomercial. I do really like the looks of your Prius. Toyota really did it up sharp now. I did consider a Prius. Could afford it. It's just personal preference with me. I've seen hard times and almost dying. The person I am has to keep it simple and inexpensive now. A Corolla isn't cheap, it's inexpensive. I like my Corolla more than the new BMW I had 30 years ago. It's much much more worth the money. It's not at all a burden on finances. Free and easy. Drives much nicer than I had ever expected.
I still confess... I envy the toys and interesting that I'm perceiving in that Prius.

If the battery is say more than half charged, you can press the EV button, and as long as you dont accelerate harshly or exceed about 35 mph it will stay in electric till the battery is exhausted. Favourite tech? The HUD, the 3 eco screens, with dozens more to scroll through. Reversing camera handy (constant beeping in reverse isn't!), ipod interface brilliant. Not used auto parking, radar adaptive cruise, crossing traffic reversing alarm thing yet. Despite a blind spot warning, I still automatically check over my shoulder while joining from a slip road!
Keyless entry and start button a treat, heated seats and dual climate the wife loves (bizarrely, an animated Prius driving over a hill when you start pleases her a lot too).
I am open for any better instructions from long term Prius owners, but the best way to maximise electric use seems to be accelerating hard to say 60-70 mph (gas), then foot off and rolling down to 45-50 (recharging battery), then catching the accelelor lightly and cruising along in electric for as long as it holds, then repeating (Road conditions/other users allowing).
This is the first car I've owned where I am looking to make unnecessary trips! The pleasure of driving it as much fun as the destination I am driving to - only miserable rain stopped me taking her out down the coast the last 2 nights. Depending on weather, may make a 150 trip today to see an indoor tropical garden and museum.
Oh yeah, it is CVT auto. I have been a lifetime anti-automatic snob! Sitting in old autos, listening to them whine away in the wrong gear and clunking up (a 1980s 3 speed Vauxhall springs to mind!), seeing every economy figure where you can add 20% to your fuel bill by choosing the auto variant of any car model, the thought of losing interaction with the drive - all made me rule out any automatic cars. I love the big old Citroën XM, but didn't buy a diesel one when I had the chance as it was automatic. I dissuaded the wife from getting several 4x4s she wanted as I slagged off their auto boxes for limiting their 4 wheel drive ability (dunno if this is even true, but I assumed so!) as well as worse economy.
As it is, this CVT transmission is fantastic, no clunking up or down, no noticeable gear change, like an old twist and go moped!
Makes for a more comfortable and relaxed drive, just nearly stalled the Honda last weekend coasting to a junction without dipping the clutch!

Just out of interest Ben, I know you said it was impulsive but what made you chose the Prius over other hybrids? Lexus have a hybrid version of every car they sell, and have just sold thier 1,000,000th hybrid. The is200 always catches my eye as a nice luxury fast hybrid, in the right colour combo, looks great and theyre cheaper than a Prius too ;)

I was originally looking to test drive Honda Jazz (no longer in production) or Yaris Hybrids - blinkered to supermini size. No Jazz at Honda dealer, walked into Toyota - as we crossed the threshold the wife said "what about something bigger?" and I will walked into the new Prius. I had never seen it before, uninterested in Prius beforehand, not a clue a new one was out.
We got in, loved the interior (the white trim seems unpopular in forums, I think it's great!). Walked around it - loved the exterior. I think it looks nothing like a Prius! Test drive immediately - loved the comfort, handling, gadgetry. As the Hyundai was in the doghouse, I was ready to switch then and there - dependant on not having to wait till August! So I got the showroom car.
Never liked Lexus - just makes me think Alan Partridge! Do I wish I d looked at the Mitsubishi PHEV? Maybe, but I doubt it would have driven as nicely, doesn't look as nice, and probably £10,000 more expensive!

That photo hadn't loaded before I replied - it is a pretty saloon! Does it have the exact same hybrid with EV as the Prius, or just IMA style hybrid - what does it get to the gallon?

You made a good choice, Ben. You can always keep playing the monday morning quarterback. Keep second guessing. In the end, you made a great choice.
Besides...That has to be the best looking Prius I've ever seen.
Congrats to Toyota and you.
It looks like it takes command of the road. It doesn't look 'sporty' like it's to play with. It looks seriously like it's to command the road. I like that.

I remember back when I had my Toy. truck. Kept looking at something new. Mainly because I was getting tired of it. That's all. I kept that 13 years. I can't remember the number of times I was looking at a vehicle. Salesman trying to put pressure on me. I'd turn around and look at my truck parked in the street. I'd think; no way...this truck is being good to me. I want a whole lot more if I buy something. And I don't want a whole lot more troubles either. I'd leave the dealership, relieved, and comfortable in my ten (or whatever at the time) year old truck.
The only reason I finally let go of that truck. It had 300 something thousand miles on it. The engine really did need to be rebuilt. Ca. pollutiion laws it was barely skimping by the inspection/testing. I kept running into BS trying to get an engine or rebuilt. So I finally donated it to a good charity.
I remember a report. An idiot bought a new Toyota. Drove it for 85k miles. Didn't even look at the engine. It ran out of oil. The big wigs in Japan offered him a new engine for free. If they could have the old one to study. I guess they thought it would be interesting. I couldn't believe they did that for an absolute idiot.

Thanks 14Corolla - coincidentally I was overtaken by a red 65 plate Lexus the same as I came back from Middlesbrough just now, handsome car, but not got the x factor (I would have picked black).
Know what you mean about an old 4x4 - we've just been round the dealers in the wife's 9 year old CR-V, she fancied looking at Audio Q3, Toyota Rav4, couple of others. The Honda worth peanuts as a trade in, and all these 2-4 year old vehicles we saw still weren't as loaded as her ES spec Honda - she couldn't face paying out loads more to have less gadgets, just for a newer ride.
Got around 60 mpg (indicated) going 70 miles up coast and moors, and 63 (indicated) coming back inland on flatter roads. Enjoyed the drive!

Most of the Lexus' Lexuses, Lexi? (Whatever the plural is!) are Toyota based, as they are part of the same company, but the one I showed you is a big 2.5 litre so the economy is compromised a bit. Still 45 to 50 MPG, not bad for a big sports saloon, but nothing to get hyped up about. What about the new Rav4 hybrid for the wifey? ;) Don't forget the Outlander hybrid is plug in only, and yes, it's probably a tad more expensive than the Prius too.

Lexi - yes very Alan Partridge! Aparantly the plural of Prius is Prii (!!!), again the same joke...Priuses, Lexuses, will do, like Hobbitses...
She test drove the Rav4, it was okay - but not enough for the money (especially as I just splurged on the Toyota...) - and nearly all 2wd, we need 4wd for the 2nd car.
We do most of our journeys together, except Saturdays when she does stuff with her mum, I do stuff with my son. Hard to justify two new cars (though we did 2 and a half years ago, but that was before a bigger mortgage...)
You seem to have the perfect balance with your Clio - you like it, high spec and good mpg

Yes, definitely....
Lexus is a Toyota. Same as Acura is a Honda. Nissan has one too. I forget the name. They were created as status symbols to compete with cars like BMW, and Audi.
Take a good look at that Red Lexus. It's a fancy Camry. They might have added some other upgrades?

If the hybrid doesn't have a plug, all its energy is coming from gas. The electric side of the system allows the reduction of the penalties from wasteful behavior in a standard ICE car; turning the engine completely off when not in use, giving a boost during acceleration, recapturing some of the energy lost from braking, etc. The input of the motor also allows the ICE the be downsized; using one with the right power output to be efficient while cruising, and not have a high hp overhead for the few times of heavy acceleration seen during a daily drive.

The Prius' great fuel economy starts with the efficient ICE. The Atkinson cycle it uses increases the fuel efficiency at the expanse of power compared to the same sized engine block used in the Corolla. Much of the efficiency improvements to the past couple of models was due to improvements to the ICE; the latest one has a 40% thermal efficiency. Approaching diesel territory, and it likely could go higher if Toyota didn't want the super ultra low emissions. Improvements to the electric side include some efficiency ones, but mostly been aimed at cost reduction.

tl;dr Hybrids get great fuel economy because they have a dog of an engine. The electric side just makes the car's performance something people are willing to drive.;)

Ben covered the EV button. With the battery charged only by the ICE, over use of it can actually reduce your overall fuel economy.

Toyota makes good, dependable cars. Most of their models tend to be on the appliance side of driving excitement though.


Have you tried opening your house door and wondered why it didn't simply unlock on its own for you yet? Smart keys are a great convenience. Saved my but from locking myself out once. I just don't value it enough to be a must have.
Try skipping the rolling down part. A fixed portion, around 27%, of the ICE's torque is always going to M/G 1. That could provide enough juice for recharging the battery during your acceleration pulse. For efficiency, you want to avoid taking energy out of the battery and putting it back in. There are losses in taking the kinetic energy from the ICE and brakes and converting it to electrical, then chemical, and back again.

Up to about 45mph or so in the gen2 Prius, you could feather the accelerator to get into a true glide; this is when the ICE is off, and no energy is coming out of or into the battery. The speed at which this is possible has increased with the newer models.

Toyota's, and Ford's hybrids are actually an eCVT, which is just the short way of saying they act like a CVT. Their hybrid transaxles are just a single planetary gear set. The ICE and M/G1(motor/generator) input to it. Along with acting as the starter and generator, the system controls M/G1's input with that of the ICE's to simulate the variable gears of a traditional CVT.

M/G2 is the larger traction motor. It inputs to the outside ring gear, or further along the drivetrain, depending on who's system you are looking at.

GM's Voltec system is also a planetary gear set eCVT, but I'm familiar enough with it to say how close it is to Toyota/Ford. Honda's two motor hybrid in the Accord is also an eCVT, but it is just a chain of fixed gears between the motor and drive axle, that the ICE can clutch into at highway speeds.

I had a gen2 Prius, which was about the only hybrid in town at the time. It was a Toyota driving appliance, and the hybrid system still had some quirks to be ironed out, but the only real complaint I had was that it had the same uncomfortable seats as our Matrix. Still a great, all around car.

Sounds like the gen4 really improves upon the fun to drive factor. I have yet to see one in person, but the styling is more striking. I was happy to see the flying bridge of the gen3 go. The worry with the white is how well will it hold up over time. It does not go with the beige interior, which isn't offered in Japan, though. I'm concerned the shifter might be too low, but I'm mostly disappointed in the loss of the upper glove box, and other storage nooks in the front. I would also prefer some space under the cargo floor for jumper cables and the like instead of having the voids filled in with foam.

The Outlander PHEV has been a big hit for Mitsu, but it's North American intro keeps getting pushed back.

We don't get the IS hybrid, but sounds like the same hybrid drivetrain as in the Camry, Avalon, and ES ones. I think it is also the one in the Rav4 and NX hybrids.

It is older than the new Prius, so it won't see those improvements until later, but the larger ICE is the main difference.

Cheers trollbait, comprehensive reply! I will see if I can practice your tips tomorrow.

We use different rounding precision in different places. I can't tell you why as it has been that way since I took over but all of the data originates from the same source, it is rounded on display.

Ok thanks for the reply. Just wanted to make sure you guys knew about it, and that it wasn't messing up any data further down the line for anyone :)

After reading through this.
That Prius doesn't have that much of battery. Does it?
Must be less than a golf cart? Much less?

I can see the brilliance in this Prius.
Charges when going downhill. Helps uphill.
Charges when coasting to a stop. Helps when accelerating.
More like it's a kinetic energy storage device.

Precisely.

Hybrids are, at their heart, still an ICE powered car. The non-ICE side doesn't even have to be electric. Plenty of work has been done with hydraulic hybrids.

Along with using recaptured energy to help later on, a hybrid can also run the ICE at a higher, efficient load at the times a straight ICE car would be only running at a low, inefficient load. The excess energy produced gets stored in the battery or accumulator for use later.

Along with allowing the use of engine off modes, the fuel economy of the hybrid can be further improved by engine downsizing. A straight ICE car needs an engine sized to provide heavy acceleration and the ability to climb steep grades. This means giving up efficiency at the engine loads where the car will spend most of its time; light acceleration and cruising.

The help the hybrid side can provide means that it can provide the power for climbing and acceleration during those shorter periods. Letting the car designers put in a lower powered engine that is most efficient for the majority of the drive.