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Old 10-26-2007, 10:42 AM   #151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by panamacolin View Post
Phuck Global Automotive...i Bought My O2 Sensor From Them And The Same **** Happend...they Were Tough To Deal With...i Finally Said Ok, You Want To Play Hard Ball Im Calling Visa And Canceling Payment And Wala They Were Willing To Refund The Cash After A Call From Visa :-)

You Should Have Listened To Me...you Would Have Saved Yourself Some Trouble....

Goodluck...

Too Bad Your Dufus Mechanic Cut Your O2 Sensor...
What kind of symptoms were you getting with your o2 sensor? Was the CEL coming on all the time, even when hot? You mentioned the car was erratic. In what way? Any specifics you can impart would be appreciated as I'd like to see if my car is doing anything yours was.

I really have the impression that my car more or less is using my o2 sensor correctly. My idle now bounces when the lights are on (it didn't use to) the idle is still high, but it was high before I put the o2 sensor in--and there is probably another cause for the high idle. (Like adjusting that screw for instance.) Other than that the car is running smooth (maybe due to open loop, but the CEL did not come on during the 1500RPM 3rd gear test) and my fuel economy has not dropped--if anything it has improved, but it is too early to tell, but certainly there is no indication of a drastic drop which, if I understand correctly, would be an indication of my o2 sensor being in open loop mode or whatever.

Anyway, if you can give detailed account of how your car behaved before and after you put the o2 sensor in Colin, I would much appreciate it.

Cheers,
Jacinto
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Old 10-26-2007, 11:33 AM   #152
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WARNING RANT enclosed in this post...

I personally think this thread is getting crazy.

[RANT]I personally dislike the mechanic that you bring your VX to Jacinto, but that is only because he sounds like one of those mechanics that think they know everything and nobody else does. How did he learn what he knows???? Did it come to him in a dream? Or did he learn it by asking questions and proposing theories and testing them? The guy needs to open his mind a bit and take things with a grain of salt IMO.

I am actually an ASE certified technician that has worked for a couple of performance shops over the last 7 years as well as hands on experience with most makes and models of cars since 1994. The reason I don't do this as a regular career anymore is because blue collar, manual labor is not what I want to spend my life doing. I enjoy having an office space and working on Network equipment and computers.

The comment that you made, Jacinto, about the info from this forum not fixing your problem is a little rude. I know that you didn't mean it to sound rude and were just using it to point out that the mechanics have fixed most of the problems on your car so far. What peeves me about that comment though, is that you need to take ALL sources of information, think about their outcomes and then make a decision based on what you come up with, or can afford. I know that you say that you aren't mechanically inclined. Mechanical inclining's can be a natural trait AND a learned trait. I suggest a cheap and easy way to learn this trait is to start off assembling car models. it's cheap and easy. If you do well with that, then you can move up to a remote controlled car assembly. This will give you a immense feeling of self esteem and understanding of how things work with eachother. The high idle issue can be caused by many things, we all gave you ideas on what we thought it was from personal experience....that list was :
  • Check for vacuum leaks
  • Replace Vacuum hoses anyway (since they are over 10 years old)
  • Idle adjust screw tweaked
  • Check the timing (distributor and cam/timing belt)

That was a suggestion of where to start looking for the cause of the problem. That doesn't necessarily mean that will solve it. There are always unknown factors that come into play. So, in the future, use the information you receive as a starting point, not an end-all bible for a fix. There are too many variables in cars to have one end all fix for a problem.[/RANT]

Ok, now that the rant is out of the way...

Jacinto, you are a resourceful person for having found the site and I have confidence in you that you can become mechanically inclined enough to start working on your own car. Don't let the brake replacement deter you.

As far as the hesitation/stumble that is normally inherent to the VX....

As is my personal experience: when at operating temps, my VX does have a slight decrease in power as it enters Lean Burn. It also has a slight stumble when coasting down to sub 30MPH speeds (as in slowing for a red light) and then pressing on the accelerator to get back up to highway speed without coming to a stop.


I've kind of lost track of my train of though as I have just returned from lunch. you're all probably sick of my long response so far anyways, so I'll stop for now.


Edit: I know that the ECU knows the time it should take for the O2 to warm up. It sounds like this new O2 is taking too long to warm up and that might be the cause of it throwing the code. This is further backed up by the fact that you were able to run about at 1500RPM for a constant amount of time right away and not have the CEL come on. The exhaust heat was helping the O2 warm up within the alotted time before the ECU would throw the CEL light.
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Old 10-26-2007, 11:55 AM   #153
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Here's a thought as far as the idle issue goes: The Fast Idle Thermo Valve could be loose. When I installed the D16Z6 ('92-95 Civic EX/Si motor) swap for my car, the plastic ring in the valve was loose, causing a high, bouncing idle. The same thing happened to a friend's 'Z6 swap a few years earlier, but I hadn't read about the FITV problem... We replaced the throttle body which cured the problem. When I later read about the common FITV issue, I realized the symptoms matched perfectly and we only needed to replace the FITV on the bottom of the throttle body, not the whole thing.
Take off the big tube between the air filter housing and the throttle body. Look inside the throttle body. On the rear surface, you should see two holes, maybe 1/2" in diameter. Here's a pic of my 'Z6's TB... You can see the holes I'm talking about, and the FITV bolted to the bottom.

The top hole feeds air to the Idle Air Control Valve (an ECU controlled valve) and maybe the idle set screw, the bottom one feeds the FITV. Start the car and let it idle. Cover the bottom hole with your thumb and see what happens to the idle. The engine will be pulling air through that hole, but it's not enough suction to hurt you... Just don't let it surprise you. The engine might stall, don't worry, you didn't hurt anything if it does.
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Old 10-26-2007, 11:58 AM   #154
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I checked my HX's O2 sensor a while back and I definitely have an L1H1 with the red wire (not blue). Oh well...it runs fine and it stopped throwing the heater malfunction code...
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Old 10-26-2007, 11:59 AM   #155
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From the two motors I have, I've never seen a FITV on a d15z1.
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Old 10-26-2007, 01:47 PM   #156
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I shouldn't have made that comment as it was pretty blatantly rude, even if I intended it not to be. I apologize to Gary and whoever else I may have offended. I don't want to get into why I said it. Bottom line is I really like this resource and I appreciate everyone's comments. Edit: Okay, I guess I do want to go into it.

Basically I think my mechanic knows his stuff, but isn't as familiar with Hondas and Imports as he is with American cars (hence it taking him an hour to run the codes on m o2 sensor) He took about 20 minutes or more just locating the jumper thingy for testing the CEL codes. So my dilemma is, if I work on my car and mess something up, I can't take it to the mechanic without receiving a severe berating and possibly him not willing to do anymore work on my car and then I'm left trying to fix it myself which puts me in a very high stress position. I go to school 5 days a week -taking 5 courses and working part time on the side, and can't really afford to be spending hours learning how to work on my car. In an ideal situation, I'd find a mechanic who isn't so mentally imbalanced as you aptly described him TomO, and someone who is okay with me getting outside help and willing to do work on my car and undo any mistakes I make without making me feel like I'm the greatest ******* on the face of the earth. The reason I want to keep my mechanic despite all his outrageous shortcomings is because I think he charges fair prices, I think he's honest (I don't feel like I need to worry about him ripping me off) he seems to be genuinely concerned about doing things right, and a big one is because he takes the time to answer my questions, explain things to me and reason things through with me, even I don't always agree with his reasonings (such as his over generalizing broad comments about outside help).

The mechanic I was going to before seemed decent as well, but he is very busy all the time and isn't interested in answering my questions or concerns.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TomO View Post
I personally think this thread is getting crazy.

[RANT]I personally dislike the mechanic that you bring your VX to Jacinto, but that is only because he sounds like one of those mechanics that think they know everything and nobody else does. How did he learn what he knows???? Did it come to him in a dream? Or did he learn it by asking questions and proposing theories and testing them? The guy needs to open his mind a bit and take things with a grain of salt IMO.

I am actually an ASE certified technician that has worked for a couple of performance shops over the last 7 years as well as hands on experience with most makes and models of cars since 1994. The reason I don't do this as a regular career anymore is because blue collar, manual labor is not what I want to spend my life doing. I enjoy having an office space and working on Network equipment and computers.

The comment that you made, Jacinto, about the info from this forum not fixing your problem is a little rude. I know that you didn't mean it to sound rude and were just using it to point out that the mechanics have fixed most of the problems on your car so far. What peeves me about that comment though, is that you need to take ALL sources of information, think about their outcomes and then make a decision based on what you come up with, or can afford. I know that you say that you aren't mechanically inclined. Mechanical inclining's can be a natural trait AND a learned trait. I suggest a cheap and easy way to learn this trait is to start off assembling car models. it's cheap and easy. If you do well with that, then you can move up to a remote controlled car assembly. This will give you a immense feeling of self esteem and understanding of how things work with eachother. The high idle issue can be caused by many things, we all gave you ideas on what we thought it was from personal experience....that list was :
  • Check for vacuum leaks
  • Replace Vacuum hoses anyway (since they are over 10 years old)
  • Idle adjust screw tweaked
  • Check the timing (distributor and cam/timing belt)

That was a suggestion of where to start looking for the cause of the problem. That doesn't necessarily mean that will solve it. There are always unknown factors that come into play. So, in the future, use the information you receive as a starting point, not an end-all bible for a fix. There are too many variables in cars to have one end all fix for a problem.[/RANT]

Ok, now that the rant is out of the way...

Jacinto, you are a resourceful person for having found the site and I have confidence in you that you can become mechanically inclined enough to start working on your own car. Don't let the brake replacement deter you.

As far as the hesitation/stumble that is normally inherent to the VX....

As is my personal experience: when at operating temps, my VX does have a slight decrease in power as it enters Lean Burn. It also has a slight stumble when coasting down to sub 30MPH speeds (as in slowing for a red light) and then pressing on the accelerator to get back up to highway speed without coming to a stop.


I've kind of lost track of my train of though as I have just returned from lunch. you're all probably sick of my long response so far anyways, so I'll stop for now.


Edit: I know that the ECU knows the time it should take for the O2 to warm up. It sounds like this new O2 is taking too long to warm up and that might be the cause of it throwing the code. This is further backed up by the fact that you were able to run about at 1500RPM for a constant amount of time right away and not have the CEL come on. The exhaust heat was helping the O2 warm up within the alotted time before the ECU would throw the CEL light.
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three stripes the charm!

Car mods are overrated. Just gotta adjust that nut behind the wheel for best mpg.



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Old 10-26-2007, 02:15 PM   #157
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Jacinto - I'm not offended. I know you're just frustrated. Rightly so if this is your only car.

I know TomO has been very helpful. He's sent me schematics and info about the cal VX to 49-state swap and has given you some real good info. We need more people like Tom on this board so I can understand his feelings about this.

Like Tom and I both have mentioned previously, take the info you get from here and your mechanic and decide accordingly. I agree with Tom that your mechanic
thinks he knows it all. I'm not ASE certified, but I've rebuilt engines and
even repainted one of my cars. I've never done it before. The only
reason I was able to do it is because I asked alot of question and I
wasn't scared to take things apart. I got alot of info from people who
was like Tom on the autobody list and the supra list. All in all, everything
I did I personally think I did better than any mechanic. If
you look at my paint job on my Eclipse and my supra projects, I think you would agree.

Gary

EDIT: I just upload pictures of my eclipse in the garage section. Click on it and
let me know what you think...
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Old 10-26-2007, 02:47 PM   #158
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My mechanic definitely thinks he knows everything, and he doesn't. And I agree the only way I am to have my car worked on to my satisfaction and standards is to do the work myself. Assuming I take the time to learn how to do it right.

Wow, paint job looks pretty pro.


TomO Based on your hypothesis, does that mean my o2 sensor is working properly once it is warmed up and the only thing wrong with it is that it's taking too long to warm up?
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Car mods are overrated. Just gotta adjust that nut behind the wheel for best mpg.



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Old 10-26-2007, 02:50 PM   #159
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Anyway, my car is running much better now. No more stuttering and stumbling all over the place, got the tires nice and pumped up and its handling much better now (whereas before the car would groan going around a fast turn; now it takes the turns with much more ease) and I owe that to all the research from the friendly people on this forum.
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three stripes the charm!

Car mods are overrated. Just gotta adjust that nut behind the wheel for best mpg.



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Old 10-26-2007, 03:24 PM   #160
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listem to tomO. start off with models and work your way up to R/C cars etc.

your mechanic sounds like most of the mechcanics out there, not willing to be told anything from anyone else. And to ask, "why dont they do this for a living?" because most of us are smart enough to not have to do manual labor on cars for a living. I myself enjoy working on cars, but not enough to get paid little money for it, i chose mechanical engineering.

i agree with tom as well, you are smart enough to find this bored and ask questions, you should be smart enought to do any work on the VX.

The civic VX is one of the simplest cars around, and i truly feel bad for anyone that need to take these cars to mechanics and pay big $$ for easy work.

The manual is your friend. Drive your car, if you have a problem, consult the manual and this board, the service manual is very straight forward for the most part, and most people can handle the work if they take their time.

and the comment about the board not helping WAS disrespectful, even if it wasnt meant to be. Everyone here is pretty smart, espeacially when it comes to specifics about the VX, they take time to help people out for FREE, unlike your mechanic. the one advantage your mechanic has is that he has the car in front of him, usually a problem can arise from many areas, and if you post up a specific problem, you will get a slew of answers and like it was said before, it is up you to decipher and figure out what is actually going on.

I know sometimes things seem overwhelming and its easier to just take it to a mechanic, but im telling you, the VX is about as simple as you can get with a modern car, so use it to your advantage. I mean, these cars cost most of us 2-3k, why pay hundreds of dollars for things simple enough to do at home?
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