Hot Air Intake too Hot, no good for MPG! - Page 2 - Fuelly Forums

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Old 12-08-2006, 11:40 PM   #11
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Hello -

I wish we had the ability to extract the Air/Fuel mappings from all these ECU/PCMs. They are all over the place in terms of what they like. Then we could optimize to the max. All that info is just sitting in the car computers lauching at us!!!!

Ho-Hum, I guess it's just trial and error.

CarloSW2
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Old 12-08-2006, 11:54 PM   #12
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SVOboy -

Quote:
Originally Posted by SVOboy
Because:

1. The IAT occupies a hole on the very aluminum intake manifold of his engine.
2. Lying is mean.

But yeah, just changing the air intake charge is the easiest way. Lying would cause problems with lean air mixtures and o2 compensation, whereas the HAI would be working with the ECU and not against it.
Yes, I agree with this waht RH77's said. Also, like Red, this is my only ride. I want to do a compromise between maximum MPG and minimum risk to car. I could mooch off my wife's car if I break my car, but that wouldn't be cool. Also, I am not a mechanic, so I am super cautious.

"Working with the ECU" is cool to me because I consider it a harder thing to innovate from within a set of rules. When you succeed, the solution can be more gratifying.

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Old 12-09-2006, 12:25 AM   #13
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rh77 -

Quote:
Originally Posted by rh77
I've never been comfortable "lying" about it, which is is why the duct-work was installed -- Saturns seem to really like the IAT mod, and other models: not so much. The concern is that you'll detonate the engine to its demise with an overly-lean situation and not let the ECU do job it was hired to do.

To maintain that ideal temp, I'm considering an installation of 2 ducts: one that draws the ambient outside air, and one closer to the exhaust manifold as I had before (I've used both idependently). The goal is to use the IAT signal to get the actual intake closest to 80-100F using a feedback loop and valves to open and close the flues of each air source. It sounds like a lot of work, but it's the safest response for a Honda engine. The IAT-resistor mod can't compensate for reality: air density, emissions system feedback, etc. which changes in an instant.

RH77
I agree with this. In the ideal, I keep imagining something like the single handle faucet ball valves that mix hot/cold water:



Obviously, there must already exist a better (larger) 2 into 1 valve mixer that could be (stepper?) motor controlled based on the IAT.

In the actual, I think that two seperate motor controlled valves is more practical in an engine bay.

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Old 12-09-2006, 03:47 AM   #14
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why not read the intake temps with this.
I have one like this but with one external temp sensor , it has 2 1/2 meters of cable and it woudl make a good intake temp monitor.

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Old 12-09-2006, 06:32 AM   #15
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WAI mod

My carbed 87 Civic manual says that it keeps the intake air at 100 degrees farenheight (it uses the typical old preheater air snorkel system).

Why not go to a junkyard and get an air cleaner assembly from a motor with a carb that already has the preheat vacuum operated valve and thermosentive vacuum bleed valve on it? You could relocate the vacuum bleed valve into the rounded part of the air snorkel just downstream from the hot air/cold air flapper valve. Then cut off the large disk shaped air filter section of the apparatus and plumb in the short section with the flapper valve and thermosensitive vaccum bleed just upstream from your air filter box- then connect to a manifold vacuum source and it should regulate itself from there onout. You may be able to "adjust" the WAI temp by bending the bimetalic spring of the vacuum bleed valve to try higher or lower WAI temps. You could probably also get the tin cover for the exhaust manifold as well and adapt it to your exhaust manifold. I think you ought to be able to get this whole assembly for $20 max. The thin metalized tubing that connects the snorkel to the exhaust manifold sheild is about $4 at discount auto parts stores (I bought one a month ago so that my stock preheat system would work properly).

Just my 2 cents..
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Old 12-09-2006, 09:16 AM   #16
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I get a constant reading when i set the multimeter to volts rather tha ohms. I will monitor the temp and adjust the hose accordingly. I would love to rig up something with those 87 parts, maybe when i get some time. Good ideas floating around in all your heads.
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Old 12-09-2006, 01:08 PM   #17
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I just threw on the stock intake and am getting between 87 and 98 degrees fahrenheit in 40 degree weather at 30-60mph with my grill block in place. With the engine warm, sitting still it is at 97 degrees. The grill block allows me to run the stock intake and achieve good iat it seems!
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Old 12-10-2006, 08:56 AM   #18
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Woo for grille blockee.

I should work on my car since it'll be warm for a few days, but what to do...
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Old 12-10-2006, 09:14 AM   #19
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Ben, we both need to do our belly pans. then we'll really have happy engines. I too plan on doing that one of these warm days. You gonna use coroplast? I was thinking of using the metal roof flashing since it can't catch fire or melt and is really flexible. we'll see, the coroplast IS free.
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