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Old 10-05-2007, 02:39 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by theclencher View Post
new beetles too. what these marketing idiots don't heed is geezers have more money and credit than the youngsters they think they're targeting with $15,000+ cars. and, geezers are more hip than the marketers give em credit for; not all of them want to float down the road in a full size tan buick
Has anybody else noticed how aerodynamicly beautiful full size cars are lately? Especially Buick. If they made a 2/3 scale Buick and cut it down to bare bones weight wise I bet it'd be a great car on gas. I'll take mine in tan, it seems the state police don't see tan cars, while they pull over red cars for farting in public.
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Old 10-05-2007, 02:45 AM   #12
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The Element was a good example of that... I don't know anyone who is young that owns one.
I sure do. Here in Vt they made it big with the Enviro/Socially conscious crowd. Most under 40, but over 30. It's not a "daddy got me this for graduation" car on the campus. It's a car they bought for themselves. I like 'em too, but I don't need 4wd, I live in VT, not Lapland.
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Old 10-06-2007, 11:29 AM   #13
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About this thread topic:

My response is that the very short story is that people are shallow, vain, ignorant, and rather live for the moment, and tomorrow be damned. Most people's ability for delayed gratification is nearly nonexistent.

People making a lousy $75,ooo an year think "Hey, I can afford a Lexus", so they get the Lexus, and their definition of affordability is that they can scrape up the monthly payment each month. Now if you take that $45,000 Lexus price take and convert that cost into "Retirement Dollars", then blowing $45,000 on a car that is rapidly devaluating is really pi$$ing awasy $45,000 x 3 or 5, so that Lexus really costs way into the 6 figures. Ouch! And we've not even added in the interest on the loan! Ouch!

People love to Justify. I deserve it! My friends have the XYZ Hot Sheet Car so I should too! What will people at work, church and neighbors think if I drive a lousy Civic? My wife & kids deserve to ride in style! Horror of horrors! Imagine the "trama" and life-long scares a poor child might be subjected to if they're forced to ride in the back of a 5 year old Camry! One could be scared for life!

Well, I'm 47 and I thank God I'm long out of that paradigm of thought. You see, I too had that mentality, and man if only I had just 1/3 of all that $$ I blew making really stupid purchases. ;-)

...All this from a poster that could buy cash any car he wants up to $150,000....Me? I splurged....I got a $13,000 2007 Toyota Yaris...what the neighbors think be damned!! lol ;-) lol

You see, I finally grew up!

I just wished the rest of the country would too!

What percentage of pick up truck, and SUV owners actuall utilize the capabilities of those vehicles? I don't know the number, but just judging from watching those drivers on the road over the last decades, I would say that maybe 5% to 10% actually need a pick up or SUV....like already said, it's 10% transportation and 90% fashion...how shallow have our American society become.... ;-(
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Old 10-06-2007, 02:34 PM   #14
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I think you are correct that what vehicles people buy has alot to do with image. I'd put it in a range between 30 utility/70 image to 60 utility/40 image depending on how vain or pragmatic the person is.

If a person just recently bought a vehicle they loved due to image and perceived utility to them and it was expensive to operate, they bear with it partly due to them reinforcing to themselves they made a good decision and partly due to hanging on to the image they want to see themselves in. Eventually after the honeymoon wears off, they are sadddled with a good looking pig they have to feed - and it gets burdensome.

If that same person bought the same vehicle and it got 40% better mileage because the manufacturer put some effort into it, the honeymoon lasts longer, the pig is now a horse they love to own, and the good decision lasts longer.

This is the strategy Honda and Toyota (and others) have used in the past but they've added relaibility. Make an attractive, well designed, reliable, fuel efficient, good driving vehicle in that order, and customers will love thier vehicles for years to come. Detroit knows this but has been often focusing on only the first items for the most part, giving the customer what they want at the time of sale, not so much down the road.

Example: Dad bought his second 'old mans' car, a buick lesabre. He loved the image, bells and whistles, comfort, etc. When he was really sold on the car was when he and mom took a trip to florida with about 60,000 on the car and they averaged 31+ mpg. He was amazed that such a comfortable car could get such good mileage and be so reliable. (Absolutely no problems even now at over 80K.) He loves that car. Detroit apparently did good on those.

Example: We were looking for a mini-van. Wanted room for kids and stuff and taking trips. Compared used Odyssey and new Caravan. Bought the Honda. Same utility, image-same, it's a mini-van, better FE, more power, drives fantastic for a van - it's actually kind of fun. My neighbor with a 3.8 Caravan gets 17mpg, we average about 22-23 (need to add it to garage) with very similar driving cycles. We chose well and love our van, they complain about it being thirsty and drive it 'cause it was cheap.
You're missing some categories. The Toyota/Honda group could be seen as people who bought a car because they could afford it and it does what it should while looking okay. Much better than the poorly designed cars from the Korea side, but definately not as "nice" as a Mercedes-Benz or the like. Fuel economy isn't even a consideration in most luxury cars, they just build the best motor they can and the efficiency works itself out.
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Old 10-06-2007, 03:30 PM   #15
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Fuel economy is a consideration for most automobile designs, including most luxury cars, and Korea builds some of the most reliable vehicles out today.
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I think if i could get that type of FE i would have no problem driving a dildo shaped car.
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Old 10-06-2007, 03:54 PM   #16
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I want an older Beamer. I heard they're just the right mix of electronic and mechanical while being near bulletproof. And a Benz, that'd be nice too...
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Old 10-06-2007, 04:17 PM   #17
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I want an older Beamer. I heard they're just the right mix of electronic and mechanical while being near bulletproof. And a Benz, that'd be nice too...
I can second that... :-)
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