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Android Users - Coming Soon! - Migrating from aCar 4.8 to 5.0

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Old 07-14-2007, 10:31 PM   #1
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New goal, New questions

Well, with my last tank passing my 400mile goal at 409.35 miles, my new goal has been raised to 450. Yes, that seems like one hell of a jump instead of a gradual incline, but I think it is possible. On my last tank I did lots of coasting in nuetral and slower speeds to get my 55.34mpg average, but little EOC unless I could get a large distance covered. Because my area is hilly, the smallest distance I chose to EOC was 1.6 miles and the largest roughly 2.4. I believe there is a 5.1mile zone on the highway that is possible, but I choose to stay on rural backroads. On this tank, Im going to EOC at these same distances, but also include some smaller areas in my commutes that will net me some free overall miles. I only need 40 extra EOC miles to achieve my goal, I think that is very plausible.

So, a few questions about EOC, mainly on starting the car back up. First off, physically turning the ignition many many times could wear out the starter much faster correct? What about drift starting, does that use the starter in anyway or does it rely on the engines momentum to start the car up. I usually drift start it in 5th or 4rth and give it alittle gas to avoid the "jump" when it catches. Are there anythings I should be concerned about or avoid when drift starting like this?

And if you dont know...95Metro/1L/manual/120,000 miles/driving technique 95% of results

Wish me luck and thanks for your knowledge!
Nic
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Old 07-15-2007, 08:15 AM   #2
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ttt, anyone?
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Old 07-15-2007, 09:44 AM   #3
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Bump start uses engine momentum to start the car . As far as ignition switch wear - I think its fairly negligable . More wear on switch from having excess weight on the key ring(c'mon ! do you really need 30 keys to drive that car ?)than ign cylinder wear . Keep the bump start as smooth as possible and avoid using too low a gear , you s'be good to go .
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Old 07-15-2007, 09:57 AM   #4
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Ok, thanks for the input Mn.

I usually start it in 5th, sometimes fourth, so I shouldn't have to worry about too low a gear. But, I try to use the appropriate gear for the appropriate speed. I just haven't had to do it in any lower speeds yet...

Huge key rings make me mad since I have to deal with stupid people's at work. I have Metro key, Mustang key, house key, Mustang remote, library and Martin's barcodes (plastic), and a little bottle opener shaped like a Mustang. Yeah, I bet you can guess I like Mustangs :P .
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Old 07-15-2007, 10:37 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baddog671 View Post
So, a few questions about EOC, mainly on starting the car back up. First off, physically turning the ignition many many times could wear out the starter much faster correct? What about drift starting, does that use the starter in anyway or does it rely on the engines momentum to start the car up. I usually drift start it in 5th or 4rth and give it alittle gas to avoid the "jump" when it catches. Are there anythings I should be concerned about or avoid when drift starting like this?

And if you dont know...95Metro/1L/manual/120,000 miles/driving technique 95% of results

Wish me luck and thanks for your knowledge!
Nic
baddog, you need to be engine off neutral coasting at every opportunity, long, short, and in-between. MetroMPG has reported a 10% mileage gain for a car like yours. I do this myself and probably have more gain than that.

Bump starts are used by all serious hypermilers. I have not heard of any parts failures attributed to this, despite considerable conjecture here.

Your starter is not used during a bump start, it's just like pushing a car to start it.

As far as your ignition switch is concerned, either an ignition kill switch or injector shutoff switch will kill the engine without touching the key. To restart, just turn the kill-switch back on and bump. Makes EOC lot easier and enjoyable. If interested in this, I can give you uncomplicated directions. Not very involved.

What speed are you coasting from/to? Must be relatively fast to be able to continue in 4th or 5th gear after bump.

You can do it.
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Old 07-15-2007, 11:37 AM   #6
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CO, thanks for the encouragment and words of knowledge, it is much appreciated.

If you look at my gaslog, my first few tanks were before I got very motivated. Pretty much just being aware that driving technique would highly increse FE so I slowed down alittle and began taking it easy. My last tank at 55+ mpg was more work to achieve but still not that difficult. On this tank I hope to go "all out" and use all the little tricks I know to max out my mileage. I probably will not make this the norm, just a little experiment to show exactly how much mpg can be boosted by very dedicated driving.

No, just becuase I can bump in 5th or 4rth doesnt mean Im going fast at all. The Metro's gears are very low and short, on flat ground it isnt hard to be cruising around in 5th @ 30mph. It can even drive at 20mph in 5th, although it doesn't like it too much. Overall, it depends on where I am and traffic as to what speeds I choose to min/max. I have very little flat driving so its hard to explain.

Im going to try to stay about 40/45 max on this tank and so far most of my minimum EOC speed has been 30ish. With slight slopes though, that 10mph difference could net me an extra mile, assuming no traffic/stops. Sometimes when Im driving at night though, there is no one out so I could slow down more to 25-20ish and go further. Im in no real hurry on this tank.

If you would like to PM me those directions, that would be very cool!
Nic
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Old 07-15-2007, 01:01 PM   #7
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Ignition kill switch or injector shutoff switch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by baddog671 View Post
CO, thanks for the encouragment and words of knowledge, it is much appreciated.

If you would like to PM me those directions, that would be very cool!
Nic
baddog, decided to just do it here. Maybe it will help others.

I have heard enough about Geos to know that with an injector shutoff, engine takes a short time to shut down because of throttle body injection. There is residual gas in the manifold that has to burn off.

The ignition shutoff may also take a short time to shut down but I think MetoMPG uses this even though I have heard him comment that maybe he should try an injector shutoff. You can't go wrong imitating MetroMPG.

jwxr7 (The Metro Experience) just installed an injector shutoff in his 73+ mpg Geo. He and I are on 'GasMisers5' Challenge Team.

OK. For an ign. shutoff you need to locate the hot wire when the ign. key is on. If you have a coil, it should be the +positive terminal at the coil. Check with a test light. All it takes is to snip this wire, extend(18 gauge is enough) the two snipped ends into the cabin and put a switch between the two.

I used a $3 switch from Walmart. Any auto parts store will have similar. A nice small switch with about a 5/8 dia. round button that rocks for off and on. I prefer a positive on/off switch rather than a contact switch you have to hold off. With an on/off switch, as soon as the engine stops turning, if in neutral, you can turn the switch back on, then put in gear and bump when ready to restart. Don't ever have to fiddle with the ignition key at all.

Mine is taped to my gearshift on the driver side in easy sight. The switch I used has a led light, handy in the dark.

If you decide to try an injector switch, you could use the same wiring and switch. Do not attempt to use both at the same time with one switch(ign. kill uses positive and I use ground to switch injector). Just leave yourself enough wire under the hood to reach either. The injector has two wires, one should be black(I will check with jwxr7 and see which he decided was the ground), the one you want to use. Just snip the wire and hook up your cabin wires. I used small electrical wire nuts for temporary splicing and have never changed them yet. You will find them at the stores that have switches.

With these switches, when off, it is possible to use the dead engine for braking if needed. Also a second or two in gear will recharge the vacuum for power brakes.

You will like it.
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Old 07-15-2007, 02:29 PM   #8
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CO, awhile back I actually posted a topic called "in-line toggles" which I was talking about doing the same thing, but to cut the running lights which are always on. I'll take this one into consideration..

I dont see the difference between installing a switch and then bumping it, or flipping the key and then bumping it. You are still turning something so its not cutting out any steps?
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Old 07-15-2007, 02:46 PM   #9
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What??

You were worried about wear on your ignition switch. And a button on the gearshift lever is much handier than fiddling with the key. I would never consider going back to key off/on.

Like I said, maybe it will benefit somebody.
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Old 07-15-2007, 02:51 PM   #10
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I meant wearing out the starter silanoid (sp) not the switch..
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