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Old 07-24-2021, 08:36 PM   #1
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Over 600 miles EV range

If the forthcoming MB meets its goals.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a3...ign=nl24442275
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Old 07-25-2021, 03:02 AM   #2
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Impressive numbers, but even a range of half that would be adequate for most people.
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Old 07-25-2021, 01:43 PM   #3
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Maybe it's using solid state batteries. I read that Mercedes already has a few prototype trucks running with solid state batteries, I wonder if this car has the same technology.
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Old 07-26-2021, 08:00 AM   #4
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Solid state may not have more energy density than 'wet' Li-ion. Its big promise is much faster charging.
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Old 07-26-2021, 09:00 AM   #5
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According to this piece from Mercedes Benz it has 25% more energy density but slower recharging.

"New: solid-state batteries – a pioneering achievement in automotive construction

The new eCitaro G is the first city bus in its category anywhere in the world to be equipped with solid-state batteries. These lithium-polymer batteries are also part of the lithium-ion group of batteries. Because they contain electrolyte in its solid form as a polymer instead of the usual liquid, they are known as solid-state batteries. The battery anode is made of graphite with pure lithium, and the cathode of lithium iron phosphate.
Solid-state batteries are characterised by their extremely high energy density, which is around 25 percent greater than in the coming generation of traditional lithium-ion batteries with liquid electrolyte. Each battery assembly in the eCitaro and eCitaro G has an energy content of 63 kWh. With seven assemblies on board this amounts to an impressive total of 441 kWh. This gives the eCitaro G a range of up to 220 kilometres in favourable conditions with average demands on speed, topography and load along with straightforward climatic conditions. In the winter with the heating in operation, the eCitaro G covers an impressive 170 kilometres. The characteristics of solid-state batteries differ significantly from NMC batteries: overall they have a greater volume and they cannot be swapped for NMC batteries.
As solid-state batteries operate at a temperature of around 80 degrees Celsius, there is no need for a complex cooling system as is the case with NMC batteries. Solid-state batteries reach their operating temperature solely through energy metabolism during use. During extended breaks, heating elements maintain the batteries at an ideal temperature. This occurs automatically in the eCitaro G with no need for the driver to take action.
In contrast to NMC batteries, the suitability of solid-state batteries for rapid charging is very limited as they have a maximum charging output of around 80 kW. Their suitability for intermediate charging is therefore severely restricted, and they are only supplied by Mercedes-Benz in combination with charging via connector. The solid-state batteries have an impressively long service life of up to ten years. Furthermore, this battery technology does not require the use of cobalt."
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Old 07-26-2021, 10:27 AM   #6
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Impressive numbers, but even a range of half that would be adequate for most people.
Maybe for most in Europe where Texas distances cover several nations but for many in the western half of the U.S. that would just be finally enough range to make an EV a viable option.
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Old 07-26-2021, 12:48 PM   #7
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Maybe for most in Europe where Texas distances cover several nations but for many in the western half of the U.S. that would just be finally enough range to make an EV a viable option.
I dunno, 300 miles would take around 4-5 hours here, there's not many people who would want to drive that long without a food and/or bathroom break. I can't remember the last time I did more than 120 miles in a day, must be pre-covid.
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Old 07-26-2021, 01:53 PM   #8
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I dunno, 300 miles would take around 4-5 hours here, there's not many people who would want to drive that long without a food and/or bathroom break. I can't remember the last time I did more than 120 miles in a day, must be pre-covid.
Yes, that would be about 4 hours in the western half of the country so a break would be good but for many that's maybe 10 minutes to make a pit stop and pick up a snack. Not nearly as long as recharging to do the other 300 miles of that day's planned travel. And still in Texas after the 600 miles, too.
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Old 07-27-2021, 11:50 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by JockoT View Post
According to this piece from Mercedes Benz it has 25% more energy density but slower recharging.

"New: solid-state batteries a pioneering achievement in automotive construction

The new eCitaro G is the first city bus in its category anywhere in the world to be equipped with solid-state batteries. These lithium-polymer batteries are also part of the lithium-ion group of batteries. Because they contain electrolyte in its solid form as a polymer instead of the usual liquid, they are known as solid-state batteries. The battery anode is made of graphite with pure lithium, and the cathode of lithium iron phosphate.
Solid-state batteries are characterised by their extremely high energy density, which is around 25 percent greater than in the coming generation of traditional lithium-ion batteries with liquid electrolyte. Each battery assembly in the eCitaro and eCitaro G has an energy content of 63 kWh. With seven assemblies on board this amounts to an impressive total of 441 kWh. This gives the eCitaro G a range of up to 220 kilometres in favourable conditions with average demands on speed, topography and load along with straightforward climatic conditions. In the winter with the heating in operation, the eCitaro G covers an impressive 170 kilometres. The characteristics of solid-state batteries differ significantly from NMC batteries: overall they have a greater volume and they cannot be swapped for NMC batteries.
As solid-state batteries operate at a temperature of around 80 degrees Celsius, there is no need for a complex cooling system as is the case with NMC batteries. Solid-state batteries reach their operating temperature solely through energy metabolism during use. During extended breaks, heating elements maintain the batteries at an ideal temperature. This occurs automatically in the eCitaro G with no need for the driver to take action.
In contrast to NMC batteries, the suitability of solid-state batteries for rapid charging is very limited as they have a maximum charging output of around 80 kW. Their suitability for intermediate charging is therefore severely restricted, and they are only supplied by Mercedes-Benz in combination with charging via connector. The solid-state batteries have an impressively long service life of up to ten years. Furthermore, this battery technology does not require the use of cobalt."
Like wet Li-ion, there is a range of types within solid state batteries. Toyota is claiming their 500km range car with them can charge in 10 minutes.

Solid state promises increased energy density, but just increasing that means longer charge times to go with the longer range. Which is why the ones being developed for cars are also going for faster charge times.

This prototype may have a solid state pack, but its range is going to be because of efficiency. The article reports MB is targeting 200mpge on the highway. If that is WLTP, that is around 178mpge EPA. The most efficient BEV in the US is the Model 3 SR+. Its highway rating is 133mpge. MB is going for a 33% increase over that.
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Old 07-27-2021, 12:13 PM   #10
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A city bus is a much better use of an EV as there is no highway use and speeds are low, always a bonus for an EV.
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