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Old 10-26-2010, 05:17 PM   #41
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what can this car achieve driven worthy of its cause?

i've read the posts and links...all intriguing, but what can this car REALLY do? we've heard GM claim 100+mpg, and we've heard critics claim as low as 20-30mpg. heck, a post on the last link claimed 35 in a Prius

we need a hypermiling driver to test drive one...thoughts?
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Old 10-26-2010, 06:13 PM   #42
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Re: Breaking news! Chevy volt technically driven by gas engine!

I think it comes down to using this vehicle for the way it was designed.

If you have a short commute around 45 miles, the Volt will be a perfect vehicle for you. It will give you the luxury of a EV vehicle but it will not leave you stranded when you deplete the battery power.

The Volt doesn't get the best mpg when in charge-sustaining mode. But it can be a killer vehicle if you use it correctly.

GM needs to sell the Volt based on what its made for and not be so Vague.
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Old 10-26-2010, 06:31 PM   #43
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Re: Breaking news! Chevy volt technically driven by gas engine!

Honestly? It is a great car. I know that my father in law's mother refused to get an electric car because "What if I need to make a long trip?" Despite the fact that she hasn't driven more than 20 miles away from her home in years.

This is the answer. It is an electric car, that is capable of taking those long trips that people occasionally take, and are scared of electric cars for.

You'll never get stuck for 12 hours while the thing charges in a standard outlet at your friend's house, or you'll never be left calling into work because you forgot to plug it in last night, and now don't have enough charge to make it to work and back.


It is a brilliant car, an electric car for people who want one, but are too scared of the inherit risks with one.

Yes, the ICE does couple with the drive motor in extended range mode over 70 mph. If it's more efficient that way, what is the trouble? Would you rather it only power the generator and be less efficient?
Yes, it gets "only" 36mpg when in extended range mode. Wow, how.. Horrible?
There are only 2 mid-size sedans on the market that can do better than that. The Prius, and the Fusion hybrid (Milan doesn't count. It is a fusion)
Neither of them can match the fact that on an average commute, the volt IS an EV.


To put it most simply, the Volt is an car for people who would want an EV, but are too scared to get one.


Heck, why don't we bash the Leaf? It gets 0mpg when not in EV mode.
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Old 10-27-2010, 05:00 PM   #44
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Re: Breaking news! Chevy volt technically driven by gas engine!

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Originally Posted by Biffmeistro View Post
Honestly? It is a great car. I know that my father in law's mother refused to get an electric car because "What if I need to make a long trip?" Despite the fact that she hasn't driven more than 20 miles away from her home in years.

This is the answer. It is an electric car, that is capable of taking those long trips that people occasionally take, and are scared of electric cars for.

You'll never get stuck for 12 hours while the thing charges in a standard outlet at your friend's house, or you'll never be left calling into work because you forgot to plug it in last night, and now don't have enough charge to make it to work and back.


It is a brilliant car, an electric car for people who want one, but are too scared of the inherit risks with one.

Yes, the ICE does couple with the drive motor in extended range mode over 70 mph. If it's more efficient that way, what is the trouble? Would you rather it only power the generator and be less efficient?
Yes, it gets "only" 36mpg when in extended range mode. Wow, how.. Horrible?
There are only 2 mid-size sedans on the market that can do better than that. The Prius, and the Fusion hybrid (Milan doesn't count. It is a fusion)
Neither of them can match the fact that on an average commute, the volt IS an EV.


To put it most simply, the Volt is an car for people who would want an EV, but are too scared to get one.
36mpg is horrible if you're buying a vehicle to be "green" and to save "green". You'd be much better off buying a Prius/Plug-in prius, even if it means you're speed limited to 62mph in pure electric mode. With the Volt and the Plug-in Prius having such poor range in EV mode, you really shouldn't be using that mode to drive at a high rate of speed on the highway as that's not the advantage of what electric vehicles hold over gasoline vehicles. It's like buying an H1 Hummer to commute in London.

Why anyone would pay such a high price premium for these vehicles just to be a smidgen more "green" or even potentially less "green" (coal power plants) than those vehicles that are already out on the market today and are far more economical. The Plug-in prius should fill the niche of people who want an electric vehicle without the price of an electric vehicle nor the inconvenience of an electric vehicle. The volt is a complete joke.. The range of 25-50 miles on the Volt is so pitiful and narrow that if that really is the sweet spot for your "all electric commute" whilst having the luxury of going on longer trips, maybe it IS for you. However, the price tag alone for this luxury should scare you and with the government subsidizing these vehicles, it's really encouraging a vehicle that shouldn't exist except for those who don't know any better. I wouldn't be surprised if in the future, people add additional batteries to their plug-in Prius vehicles, giving it the same or better range as the Volt.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Biffmeistro View Post
Heck, why don't we bash the Leaf? It gets 0mpg when not in EV mode.
This response makes no sense in response to any conceivable question. 0mpg first of all doesn't apply to the leaf since it doesn't burn gasoline and secondly your point about it not being in EV mode makes no sense because it's always in EV mode. I have a vague idea of what you're getting at but you're still wrong. You're wrong because you're paying a huge price premium for little to no benefit. The Volt is more expensive than the Leaf whilst not doing anything particularly well. It has poor range as an electric and poor fuel economy/range as a gasoline vehicle. If you want a vehicle that can potentially be all electric and work as a gasoline hybrid, the Plug-in Prius, which I'm sure will be cheaper, would make more sense. If you want a real electric vehicle, I'd wait for the Ford Focus EV before getting the Leaf.


There are far too many things going against the Volt that makes it difficult to see it's an appealing vehicle at all. Why does the volt get at worse 30 and at best 50mpg when the Prius can do better than that kind of mileage unless GM really does have such garbage engine designs? 40 mile all electric range would drop to 10 miles where I live thanks to all the rolling hills and steep terrain of California...yet this is the exact demographic the volt is appealing to. [Just think of the transmission gear ratio of the CRX HF Federal (2.95) vs California/High Altitude (3.25)]
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Old 10-27-2010, 05:13 PM   #45
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Re: what can this car achieve driven worthy of its cause?

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Originally Posted by bowtieguy View Post
i've read the posts and links...all intriguing, but what can this car REALLY do? we've heard GM claim 100+mpg, and we've heard critics claim as low as 20-30mpg. heck, a post on the last link claimed 35 in a Prius

we need a hypermiling driver to test drive one...thoughts?
The difference is, GM is claiming 100mpg based upon using the EV mode, not in charge sustained mode. It skews the results and paints a prettier picture then it really is. Charge sustained mode is the only MPG that we should be concerned with. This whole mixing and matching and "but what if" scenarios with the EV mode and charge sustained mode is just a bunch of marketing gimmicks. People would be ****ting themselves if Toyota was promoting the Prius as getting 90mpg, when really, to get 90mpg, you have to be a hypermiler and driving on flat, empty roads. It just feels disingenuous to call the Volt a high MPG vehicle when that MPG number perfectly masquerades the vehicle's actual efficiency by not even factoring in the electricity that was generated and used to power the vehicle. At least when you call a Prius a 50mpg vehicle, the whole environmental and efficiency picture is clear. No manipulation or lying to achieve that number, just simple standardized testing. But with the Volt claiming this ridiculous MPG numbers, it implies one thing but it's actually something else. At the very least, the volt's MPG numbers need a large asterisk beside them.
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Old 10-27-2010, 07:08 PM   #46
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Re: Breaking news! Chevy volt technically driven by gas engine!

I don't get what everybody has their panties in a bunch about it. Its an electric car with a 40 mile range. You plug it in every night and you drive electric the next day. Its not like GM set it up to only drive electric once your gasoline tank is empty.

Quote:
But OMGWTFBBQ the range extender only gets 36mpg, blah blah blah, bloody murder!
Get over it. If you don't like it, don't buy it. Plenty of other people will and the vast majority will plug it in every night.
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Old 10-27-2010, 07:12 PM   #47
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Re: Breaking news! Chevy volt technically driven by gas engine!

i'm not convinced of the lies and deception claim. i'm a former GM guy(hence bowtieguy) that has forsaken them not because of products, engineering, or performance, but because of unions, bailouts, and lack of future vision.

now, i think it's clear that this is a different type of vehicle--not a full ICE, and not a conventional hybrid(and certainly not fully electric). over priced and over promised? perhaps, but GM cannot afford to sell for little or no profit, especially now.

take it for what it is.
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Old 10-27-2010, 08:09 PM   #48
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Re: Breaking news! Chevy volt technically driven by gas engine!

Honestly, I feel if your regular driving habits would make you cringe at 30 MPG for extended range mode, then this car isn't right for you. You belong in a Prius. If, on the other hand, you would rarely use extended range mode, (such as with my regular route) then this turns into an ideal vehicle.
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Old 10-28-2010, 05:58 AM   #49
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Re: Breaking news! Chevy volt technically driven by gas engine!

As I understand, that's the entire point of the vehicle. It's not intended first for people who need to run on gas for extended trips, its main purpose is for people who can drive it all-electric every day but are worried that they'll get stranded.
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Old 10-28-2010, 12:34 PM   #50
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Re: Breaking news! Chevy volt technically driven by gas engine!

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Originally Posted by Jay2TheRescue View Post
Honestly, I feel if your regular driving habits would make you cringe at 30 MPG for extended range mode, then this car isn't right for you. You belong in a Prius. If, on the other hand, you would rarely use extended range mode, (such as with my regular route) then this turns into an ideal vehicle.

Right. I could drive it all week and use NO gas as long as I plugged it in at night. Then on the weekend I could drive it to Maryland and not worry about the battery crapping out and be stranded on the road somewhere.

I would use NO gas all week. That sounds just awesome to me. I can't do that now.
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