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Old 09-11-2007, 02:17 PM   #1
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Anyone here about this new pre-ignition catalytic converter (picc)?

Has anyone heard of this thing? I came across it today and i'm wondering if anyone seen this before. Supposedly, it replaces your existing cat and can increase FE up to 5 times what you are getting now. I would explain it to you but it is a little complicated. Here is the link to the video, very interesting:

http://www.preignitioncc.com/miracleproducts/index.htm
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Old 09-11-2007, 02:59 PM   #2
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hmm...

cliff notes on how it works?
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Old 09-11-2007, 03:06 PM   #3
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I'll take a million! Will you take a post-dated check?
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I think if i could get that type of FE i would have no problem driving a dildo shaped car.
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Old 09-11-2007, 03:29 PM   #4
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tahts noy shirley!
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I think if i could get that type of FE i would have no problem driving a dildo shaped car.
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Old 09-11-2007, 04:04 PM   #5
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That was a waste of 20 minutes, horrible video presentation IMO.

Cliff notes of what it does; its a device that will apparently replace your biggest cat. Built into it are three ports, one that takes air (spaced out here), one that takes water and another with takes fuel. Inside the cat the mix is automagaically subjugated to an electrical storm of charged particles that turns this voodoo mix into plasma. This plasma is then injected into the engine via some kind of TBI system, I believe, and your gas mileage will now skyrocket. And since your engine will burn so cleanly now, you will never need to do an oil change as well.

All told, it just looks like a really fancy fuel/water heater.
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Old 09-11-2007, 05:40 PM   #6
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So I should expect to start getting close to 300 mpg?!?!? I'll take 5! Why? With all the money I am going to save in gas, I figure that I can afford it!!!
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Old 09-11-2007, 09:11 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red View Post
And since your engine will burn so cleanly now, you will never need to do an oil change as well.
So I was thinking, before I heard that statement, okay - lets give them the benefit of the untested gimmick...

Blah - as if we change our oil ONLY because it gets dirty.

So I submitted for a quote - just for fun...

Quote:
We know people are feeling the pinch from increases in fuel prices. As a courtesy,ONLY forthose who are waiting for the PICC, we have taken some of the more substantial energy saving devices on the market and prepared an interim solution while you are waiting for the ultimate solution (PICC). We have developed a hybrid fuel savings kit that we call the Hydro-Assist Fuel Cell (HAFC) kit. We have arranged for you to take advantage of this kit at no risk and for a full credit of any money paid for it if you decide to upgrade to the PICC when it is finallyavailable toyou. The HAFC is available to be installed on your car. It is guaranteed to give you from a 50% to a 100% plus increase in fuel economy NOW! At no cost, you may view another video that explains the HAFC offer, http://www.preignitioncc.com/cust/viewHafcVideo.htm. You may get the HAFCkit and be satisfied with the savings and decideagainst a PICCupgrade. That choice will be yours. Itwill cost you nothing to try the HAFC until your PICC is ready for purchase. Our customer service representative will explain how this works. Of course there is no obligation to do anything.
Here's some more crap from the same company...

http://www.bwanetwork.com/products.htm?RepID=
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Old 09-11-2007, 09:15 PM   #8
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My best guess explanation.

I wouldn't spend any money for this. There is some legitimacy to the concept but It does not work out too well in long term applications. I only watched the first third of the movie though. This is Paul Pantone's idea.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Pantone

Maybe he is out of prison now. I paid $175 for a set of his plans and they were hand drawn showing the central component of the reactor held with twisted wire. MPGmike worked with Paul for some time. He could tell you all about this. It sort of works but requires constant fiddling. There is a fellow who was in Canada I have seen post on Somender's site and the GEO sites. He worked his butt off trying to make this work but he never got better mileage than normal. His name was Jeremiah.

I went to a conference here in Boise. I could see many of the failings of the system. It was interesting because Paul did not like working on engines but had intelligent hard working younger people trying to make a go of it. He said an angel had actually given him the idea. I watched a man who was taken in write out a high dollar check for a dealer ship. It made me sick but I did not know what to do. I was afraid to try to stop him.

You have seen the engine run so you think maybe you can make this work. Try to put some chemistry and thought into it. It is running on a mixture of fuel and water but with no load. At this point I will go into my own speculation. There is a thing called hydrogen burner technology.

http://www.poweronline.com/storefronts/hbt.html

"Through a unique patented burner design and reactor vessel configuration, HBT's Under Oxidized Burner® can reform virtually any hydrocarbon feedstock into the basic chemical constituents of hydrogen, carbon monoxide, carbon dioxide and water vapor. The UOB design is effective, simple and uncomplicated, and therefore, low in capital cost, providing an economic advantage over other types of hydrogen generation technologies."

http://www.sae.org/technical/papers/2000-01-0009

They used to have the chemical formula on their web page. If you supply a reactor vessel with a very rich mixture you can burn the carbon out of a hydrocarbon fuel and end up with hydrogen and carbon monoxide. Now here is where it seems odd. If you supply water to this reactor the carbon monoxide can react with the water and dramatically increase the amount of hydrogen. In fact if the hydrocarbon feed stock was methane you can double the amount of hydrogen. Hydrogen burner technology is a legitimate way of producing hydrogen. It is an exothermic reaction and the heating value of the hydrogen you produce is less than the heating value of the fuel you started with. I should write out the balanced chemical equation but I am afraid I would embarrass myself.

I think a similar reaction is going on in the GEET reactor of what ever Dennis Lee is calling it now. The reaction is legitimate but that does not mean the claims are legit. I rode in Paul Pan tone's demonstration truck. It was a gutless wonder. Hydrogen rich combustion has some advantages but when you burn half the fuel before you feed it to the engine it needs to be darn good to get better mileage. MPGmike said he did achieve some very good results but the system was not robust or reliable enough for normal use. He left Paul before Paul went to jail. This is in some of his posts on other sites. Sorry I did not take the time to find it.

This is a compilation from many years of searching the Internet. If I have misquoted of taken a name in vain I apologize. I know I have not backed up everything I said with the references. This is just one opinion and we all have them and other things.

Here is a real application for such a device.

http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/59...scription.html

Adding hydrogen to the exhaust stream can reduce NOx. Daimler used a device that looked amazingly like this device to produce the hydrogen to feed into the exhaust. This was just a small hydrogen stream for controlling emissions but the reaction vessel looked very similar to the Geet reactor. I have wondered several times if Paul Pantone ever saw that. I just want to say the reaction is real but the mileage claims are hard to believe.

Good luck in your search for better mileage.
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Old 09-12-2007, 01:58 AM   #9
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...I watched a man who was taken in write out a high dollar check for a dealer ship...
Wow, If you didn't personally know the man I would suspect a charade.
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Old 09-12-2007, 04:38 PM   #10
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I ran out of time last night. Here is a link to the hydrogen production concept.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_production

Here is another idea that was much more successful at burning water. But even this idea is fading away though many of the claims appeared to be more or less true and it briefly caught the attention of some big names in Diesel engines because of the potential to reduce NOx.

http://www.rbbi.com/folders/fuel/a-21.htm

http://himacresearch.com/docs/gunn2.html
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